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Thread: Help diagnosing DT40 amp fault

  1. #1
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    Default Help diagnosing DT40 amp fault

    Well, everything i touch seems to be failing at the moment []

    I've been doing some work on my 8W projectors, swapping out the DPSS for DI greens.

    Just went to power up to start dealing with the optic placement and my X galvo isn't moving.

    I am running Scannermax 506 with DT40 amps that were modified by Bill Benner.

    So far I have checked:
    Fuse - good
    Swapped galvo cables at the amp, the problem stays with the bad amp, so rules out galvo and cable. When powered the X galvo is held still by the amp but it doesn't move.
    Swapped power cables from PSU - the bad board stays bad with the good power feed connected

    There are 2 green LEDs on these boards, on the bad board only one is lit, but I'm not sure if its always been like that.

    Can anyone who is familiar with these tell me where to go next please? I have a reasonable DMM, but no scope. One for Mixedgas perhaps?
    Last edited by norty303; 03-06-2017 at 13:49.
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

  2. #2
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    Not to worry - went back and checked whole signal path from start and it looks like bad ribbon from ILDA in to breakout board
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

  3. #3
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    The driver not easy broken,most is the galvo broken
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    Quote Originally Posted by jian725 View Post
    The driver not easy broken,most is the galvo broken
    That would be surprising! Likely one of the first ever broken Compact 506 scanners out of over 10,000 in circulation

    Compared to the pile of broken DT40 amps I have....
    Sincerely,
    Ryan Smith
    ScannerMAX Mechanical Engineer
    ryan {at} scannermax.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by rns0504 View Post
    That would be surprising! Likely one of the first ever broken Compact 506 scanners out of over 10,000 in circulation

    Compared to the pile of broken DT40 amps I have....
    i've seen broken 506 amps.
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rns0504 View Post
    That would be surprising! Likely one of the first ever broken Compact 506 scanners out of over 10,000 in circulation

    Compared to the pile of broken DT40 amps I have....
    Now we don't repair the driver,that is replace new pcs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by swami
    i've seen broken 506 amps.
    You are one of the very lucky few!

    Quote Originally Posted by jian
    Now we don't repair the driver,that is replace new pcs
    I wish that were an easy process with these


    But regardless of all that....

    Quote Originally Posted by me
    looks like bad ribbon from ILDA in to breakout board
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

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    wasn't really lucky since it killed a project for a week...

    to be fair, it was a third party amp since pangolin doesn't (or wasn't at the time) make amps for 506's.



    Quote Originally Posted by norty303 View Post
    You are one of the very lucky few!



    I wish that were an easy process with these


    But regardless of all that....
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by swami
    it was a third party amp since pangolin doesn't (or wasn't at the time) make amps for 506's.
    Hence my comment that if you'd seen a broken Pango amp (Unicorn?) you must be very lucky indeed....

    So, is there an 'official' amp available now for the 506's? Digital?
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

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    Replace the 7815 regulator if the + LED is out. Replace the 7915 regulator if the - LED is out. Before connecting the galvo, check and see if the regulators output the correct voltage. Often times just the 7915 blows from turn on spikes. The 7815 supplies about 100 mA and the 7915 supplies about 40-60 mA. They die because their upper limit on the input of 23 volts is obviously exceeded from time to time.

    For a 78/79 series regulator, the upper limit is supposed to be (Vout +7 volts) maximum. That upper limit keeps growing on the data sheets.

    The 78/79 pair powers all the opamps, the leds, and the positive one also supplies the position sensor with about 60 mA..

    Steve
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    Thanks Steve. The amp actually drives the galvo just fine with the led out. What would be the effect if one of the components was out?
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

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    If you connect +/-24V correct 2 LED all bright.when connect reversal the 7815 or 7915 will broken.
    Normal circumstances 7815 and 7915 almsot no damage.

    Repair the driver real a waste of time work and hard work,unless some physics damage you can see.
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    Hi Jian can we order directly from you ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BruceLavender View Post
    Hi Jian can we order directly from you ?
    Why not?
    But don't driver only
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    Jian these boards were shipped to Pangolin and Bill Benner modified them to work with the 506 scanners. So it would be worth repairing as it wouldn't just be a straight swap.
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    You are using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?

    I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by norty303 View Post
    Jian these boards were shipped to Pangolin and Bill Benner modified them to work with the 506 scanners. So it would be worth repairing as it wouldn't just be a straight swap.
    I know,just we have not much experience repair the driver,sorry I can't give you more suggest to repair the driver.
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    Still check the regulated voltages from the two regulators. The LEDs run off the regulated power thru a current limiting resistor. So if the amp is working, you may have just lost the Led to reverse voltage or something similar.

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    You say your still scanning.

    If however one of the regulators is blown or shorted on, you may exceed the rated voltage of the TL084 opamps, in which means eventually something else may die.

    S.

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    Mach Mini has been shelved

    C506 will begin shipping with Mach DSP shortly- identical to Saturn configuration with a few resistor and capacitor changes - perhaps end of march. Orders are already beginning to stack up, waiting on one more component before it is (finally) a full turnkey solution.

    Will also be stocking Kvant and Laser Fantasy amps for those needing an analog solution, although the pricing will be about the same...
    Sincerely,
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    Quote Originally Posted by rns0504 View Post
    Mach Mini has been shelved

    C506 will begin shipping with Mach DSP shortly- identical to Saturn configuration with a few resistor and capacitor changes - perhaps end of march. Orders are already beginning to stack up, waiting on one more component before it is (finally) a full turnkey solution.

    Will also be stocking Kvant and Laser Fantasy amps for those needing an analog solution, although the pricing will be about the same...
    will the amps be available without the galvos for those of us who would like to upgrade our amps?
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by swamidog View Post
    will the amps be available without the galvos for those of us who would like to upgrade our amps?
    Likely will be handled on a case by case basis- in blunt terms, on the competency level of the end user, as well as other things. Tuning the Mach DSP digital amp is a whole different animal which is much easier than a traditional analog driver to tune - once you know what you are doing. Without experience, it is easy to mess things up quickly. I shattered a set of mirrors on a client demo instantly (by clicking the wrong button in the software) the first time I tried operating the program without BB watching - a bit embarrassing but learned quickly!

    Also, the PD board on C506 w/ DSP is different than anything we will have ever shipped, so the PD board will need to be changed. Not a difficult task for competent hands, but to inexperienced users they can instantly shear the coil wires inside the galvo if done improperly, making the galvo basically junk. Existing PDs can be used, but the cables are a huge pain in the ass to make, and the crimpers to make them properly are $2000. Instead, the new PD board will share the Saturn connector, so cables will be interchangeable with Saturn and C506. Also a much more durable cable.

    Finally, the DSP needs the "AW50" configuration, not the "standard" configuration. Can measure the coil resistance on your current scanners to see which version you have - 1.75 to 2 ohms or so is the AW50, and 2.75 to 3 ohms or so is the Standard.

    In most cases, it will be likely most efficient for existing galvos to be returned to Pangolin for the PD swap and tuning to be created and loaded. Not sure on what any of this will cost yet as this is all theoretical and not really up to me, but I know full systems are currently being quoted/paid at $795-$995/set, depending on volume, mirror coating, and number of tunings needed (integrator, PDF, PDFF, etc)
    Sincerely,
    Ryan Smith
    ScannerMAX Mechanical Engineer
    ryan {at} scannermax.com

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    sure. i'd be totally into shipping galvos back to be tweaked and turned for amps. no worries. i'd rather have you guys do it than me.

    Quote Originally Posted by rns0504 View Post
    Likely will be handled on a case by case basis- in blunt terms, on the competency level of the end user, as well as other things. Tuning the Mach DSP digital amp is a whole different animal which is much easier than a traditional analog driver to tune - once you know what you are doing. Without experience, it is easy to mess things up quickly. I shattered a set of mirrors on a client demo instantly (by clicking the wrong button in the software) the first time I tried operating the program without BB watching - a bit embarrassing but learned quickly!

    Also, the PD board on C506 w/ DSP is different than anything we will have ever shipped, so the PD board will need to be changed. Not a difficult task for competent hands, but to inexperienced users they can instantly shear the coil wires inside the galvo if done improperly, making the galvo basically junk. Existing PDs can be used, but the cables are a huge pain in the ass to make, and the crimpers to make them properly are $2000. Instead, the new PD board will share the Saturn connector, so cables will be interchangeable with Saturn and C506. Also a much more durable cable.

    Finally, the DSP needs the "AW50" configuration, not the "standard" configuration. Can measure the coil resistance on your current scanners to see which version you have - 1.75 to 2 ohms or so is the AW50, and 2.75 to 3 ohms or so is the Standard.

    In most cases, it will be likely most efficient for existing galvos to be returned to Pangolin for the PD swap and tuning to be created and loaded. Not sure on what any of this will cost yet as this is all theoretical and not really up to me, but I know full systems are currently being quoted/paid at $795-$995/set, depending on volume, mirror coating, and number of tunings needed (integrator, PDF, PDFF, etc)
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

  23. #23
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    Compact 506's with the awesome DSP amp is reasonably drool-worthy. Re-tuning with a PC and all of the available diagnostic tools is, dare I say, fun.

    -David
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkumpula View Post
    Compact 506's with the awesome DSP amp is reasonably drool-worthy. Re-tuning with a PC and all of the available diagnostic tools is, dare I say, fun.

    -David
    There are buttons and functions that I still dont know what they do
    Sincerely,
    Ryan Smith
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    ryan {at} scannermax.com

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    one of them plays old trucker songs from an 8-track. i still haven't figured out why it's there, but it's kind of awesome.

    Quote Originally Posted by rns0504 View Post
    There are buttons and functions that I still dont know what they do
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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