Scannermax 506s

Quote:

---

think you missed the point. All is not ''business'' and ''money'' dear Masterpj...At least for us.

---

I think for every company that steps in another market then there is something to gain. I don,t think to majority here has a clear view why Pangolin steps in to the scannermarket. Do people really think that Pangolin or any other company that exploring a different market is just because they want to make the world better without any form of gain , financially or other? Below is a list of why Pangolin is moving towards the scanner market:

1: Money, because every chinese box will have Pangolin scanners in them just like now every chinese box comes with an FB3
2: If a customer has problems with their scanners and the customer don,t use pangolin they can say its the software that is causing the problem so buy Pangolin
3: Saving time and there for money on all the questions they get with their software not working properly and in the end it turns out to be faulty scanners.
4: If a customer has problems with software and the customer don,t use pangolin scanner they can say its the scanners so they should buy scannermax.
5: Control of the market, who has the chinese market both on scanners and software is the winner, quickshow has proven that in the past.

Pangolin represents themselves as a the company that helps everyone with out any kind of gain. They clearly had a good view of where the market was going a few years ago. Now that every chinese box comes with a quickshow package every 15 year old learns that software and is a potential customer for a beyond package. So that was a smart move.

The thing that anoys me with Pangolin is transparency is lost when it comes do their intentions. I,m 100% sure the Eyemagics are perfect since Tom is on the market for years and he is constantly improving his products. Pangolin has because of the software bussiness a huge cashflow so they can quickly develop things or step into a new market where Eyemagic is smaller in therms of bussiness. Pangolin can quickly outsource a product like the scanners because of that cashflow. They can also offer scanners at a lower price then what others can because they can finance mass production. They know that the huge china market needs cheap scanners the same as they did a few years ago with quickshow. The biggest market is the low end market and the majority goes for a cheap box from china. Just a reminder for those who missed it:

Quote:

---

They won't be sold to individuals at that low price, but will be sold to OEM companies who are willing to order more than 100 pieces at a time.

---

You don,t need to be a professor to see what Pangolin their intentions are....... And for Eyemagic? A damn good product with someone who stands behind his product with excellent service. I can see clearly what Tom,s intensions are;)

In thought it was good to keep things transparent, its all bussiness and nothing else. [popcorn]

You seem to say all of that as if its a bad thing Edison?
Surely a decent set of scanners at an affordable price benefits all of us? Having a scanner that everyone wants in your projector makes your projector more valuable to the consumer surely?

Yes, there has been a gap in the market for a decent lower end scanner for years. Current scanners are based on an old design, so its about time someone stepped up and brought us into the 21st century. And if someone can do it for less money than the current crop of scanners (DT's, etc) then good for them. It suits me just fine.

I don't think that anyone is naive enough to think this is all being done for charity - its business, and if you have low prices you need to ship volumes to make profit.
The Chinese market is where its at for low to mid range projectors, and now they can be better.

The higher end stuff still has its place, as do EM, CT and Saturn variant scanners, and their success remains to be seen.

Yes, I could probably do without reading some of the sniping on forums, but to hold it against someone with a good product (to be seen, tbf... ;) ) and a good price - I simply don't see where you're coming from.

Nope not at all, in fact it is great if there is a good quality lower priced alternative comes on the market. For some purposes its might be convinient like waving beams like 99% is doing. Just keeping things real and nothing else:)

Really, Edison? Transparency? Do something for me. Go to Pangolin's Scannermax site and from the site, in full public view, look at the specs for the new scanners. After that, go to the EMS website and do the same...... oh wait, you need to request information from EMS.

Edison,

I can't help it. Aside from optics my other passion is politics. This planet could use a few more companies like Pangolin (AND Eye Magic for that matter). Hard work and innovation driven by self interest got us out of the caves. Muddle headed altruism, "just do it for the good of us all" even those of us that can't manage to get out of the bed in the morning is not helping anyone in the long run. Putting aside our questionable foreign policy over the last century the profit motive in US manufacturing drove the development of countless technologies and way overshadowed the productivity of European socialist states. Alas, the West has been moving into a homogeneous, anti-capitalistic policy that may very well be its doom.

Eye Magic's product may be a good alternative to Pangolin or it may not. I have a pair of 8000s coming in the next few days and I will take Bill up on his offer to set up another projector with the highest performance that Pangolin can offer.A side by side comparison by a third party may provide some motivation to these manufacturers to improve, discount or modify their product. I can't see how this won't be good for us.

With transparancy i don,t mean overal performance , i mean transparency in bussiness. Pangolin has a reputation of saying we are doing everything just to help the lasercommunity and that is just Bullshit. There is much to gain for them entering the scannermarket. Many people here on PL think Pangolin is the boy next door that is that helping them for free. Its not its just bussiness. I just want to make things clear on what their intententions are and what they gain from it. You don,t see companies like showtacle or eyemagic scream on PL that they do everything just to help everyone because they feel like it. If 80% of this forum is used to quickshow and then 50% buys beyond in the future and uses their scanners then the gain financially and they gain customers. If the scannermax have proven to be a great product that is great and an addition to the market but i can clearly see what the market value is for Pangolin. If the scannermax weren,t affordable for most people here there wasn,t so much excitement. The majority jumps trough the roof when a quality product comes on the market just because its cheap and that is fine. I think once in a while someone has to pop the balloon and things get back to reallity. Its just bussiness and if 90% of all PL and chinese market uses their products that is the only goal. Plain and simple.


Just keeping things real.

@ planters: Great to see your doing a side by side comparison. I will buy a set in the future and compare them with the eyemagics myself since they have my attention :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by edison

You don,t see companies like showtacle or eyemagic scream

---

...... I'm coming to the next LEM and you guys can question me for hours about products. Or working on a Lexel 95 power supply - hot (for free) in the hallway floor teaching people all the while (Thank you too, Steve). You do see Bill and Co. at these events bearing help and gifts.

Exactly because bill and co are laserenthousiasts that are still have a passion for lasers. That is great but what does that have to do with pangolin entering the scannermarket. I give away free stuff also or for dirt cheap last year when a great guy wanted to play with lasers. That reminds me i need to ask if he is going to the lem.
We will see how good the scanners are but please can we keep things real here and keep in mind that Pangolin is a company instead of the average hobbyist that has joined this forum. [popcorn]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by edison

With transparancy i don,t mean overal performance , i mean transparency in bussiness. Pangolin has a reputation of saying we are doing everything just to help the lasercommunity and that is just Bullshit. There is much to gain for them entering the scannermarket.

---

Do you not think that there's duality in that they are gaining AND helping the laser market?

At the end of the day, they're not a charity and I don't think anybody's under any illusions that they produce products at cost price only and that Bill Benner is really Santa Claus. But if they can make a modest profit and bring a cheap high performance scanner within the reach of mere mortals, then that IS helping the laser community and it HAS to be a good thing for both the community and Pangolin.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mophead

...... You do see Bill and Co. at these events bearing help and gifts.

---

+1.

How many people on here have benefited from free scanner tuning, a free consultancy, free help or a free technical lecture at a LEM from Pangolin that might otherwise have cost hundreds of dollars?

So, Edison, before you criticise Pangolin for being in business, which is actually what they're in the business of doing, don't lose sight of all the free tuning, advice and help they've given to people, which WAS given for purely charitable purposes. At the end of the day it's give and take. If they didn't make a profit they wouldn't exist and if they didn't exist, they wouldn't be there to make those charitable gestures or to potentially bring high quality scanning down in price.

Modest? Do you think the safety lenses they offer are modest in Price just to make the laserentertainment industry more save because they care? Ask a price for 1000 sets of these lenses and you will find out that they are 10 usd each from an optical supplier or even less.They should give them away as a promotiongift on every Prolight and sound event.

Mass production of a quality product and selling it for a modest or cheap price has nothing to do with helping. Its trying to take over the (china) market, push away competitors and make money. I don,t find this as helping but i think the majority see,s it as a helping since they have to spend less. Second when you help people that is part of the bussiness. You can,t charge for every minute that you spend on a customer. Most people that are self employed make 60 hours in a week and can charge 40 but they like what they do and that is why they do it.

But its good to see you have a clear view that they are not santaclaus and that you have some understanding on how the world works. I,m not here to offend anyone its an open forum and i,m expressing just my opinion on what i read on PL. :)