Future Pricing of 445's

I've seen some people discuss that the price of the 445nm lasers will go back up in price because Casio is no longer going to manufacture the projector with the laser diodes. It would seem that the supply would be low, and cause the prices to go back up, but I find that hard to believe since technology prices usually go down overtime. I think the cat is already out of the bag. I'm also curious to find out how many of these projectors were made. Anyone have a clue? Do you think these are going to drive the price of 473's down too because the demand may go down as a result? I know no one really knows what exactly is going to happen, but just curious to hear your thoughts.

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Casio is no longer going to manufacture the projector with the laser diodes

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Have you got a link to this information?

that rumor started the day the casios came out... I guarantee you they are not going anywhere any time soon ;)

I agree, Casio would be mad to stop production.

With the diode manufacturer not selling diodes directly, this must be Casio's best ever selling projector!!!

Remember its not just hobbyists, I reckon before too long some of the smaller laser manufacturing companies will start harvesting to enable them to build cheap 445 off the shelf modules, if they haven't already. I'm just suprised we haven't seen a flood of certain laser globe :) or similary named units.

If i was the Casio MD, I'd be making available spare blue light units at a handsome (from Casio's POV) price and then ramping production. Potentially they could make more profit per spare unit than per projector due to less components, and still have the units cheaper than a whole projector and have less wastage. Winners all round!

I really don't have any solid sources, just what Bill wrote in this thread:

http://www.photonlexicon.com/forums/...ester-with-FB3

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- I am honestly not sure that the cheap blue sources are here, at least not for long. Sure, the cheap blue sources are here for some people, and for some length of time. But for me, the question is -- for what people and for what length of time?

Of course we've heard that people are harvesting 445nM blue diodes from Casio projectors. But, unless you're on the inside track, you might not have heard that Casio has pulled these from the shelves, and their lawyers are prepared to send out a letter, warning people not to remove them under the threat of legal action. Sure, for hobbyists, I doubt Casio will be knocking on your door, but for anyone actively selling these diodes, or products (for example laser pointers) in large volume, I think there could be trouble here...

Also, what I have heard is that Casio is happy with the results of the projector -- I mean happy with the blue source, and happy that the process of blue creating a green source works, but for the future they will come out with a projector that has a different kind of blue laser -- a kind of "diode bar" that will not be useful for lightshow applications.

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I have no idea whether this is true or not.. but I wouldn't be surprised either way.

Has Casio pulled them from shelves? Quite the opposite I would say!

Regardless of what happens to the Casio projector, I think that these diodes are just the beginning. I expect that better diodes will follow. They might not be as cheap if they aren't mass produced but I do feel good knowing that someone somewhere is probably working on an idea for a better version that will eventually trickle down to our level. It's just a matter of time. For now, buy of few spares of the Casio 445nm diodes... they might not be around too long. But don't be a fool and invest in them for some fancy laser design unless your time to market is immediate.

like I said, a few days after this all started it was claimed that they were being pulled from the shelves blah blah, recalled etc... trust me Casio just wants to sell projectors, if you want to rip it apart thats one less warranty they have to worry about...

I can still order these (and do, but for their intended purpose) from any of my suppliers

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Originally Posted by JohnYayas

Regardless of what happens to the Casio projector, I think that these diodes are just the beginning. I expect that better diodes will follow. They might not be as cheap if they aren't mass produced but I do feel good knowing that someone somewhere is probably working on an idea for a better version that will eventually trickle down to our level. It's just a matter of time. For now, buy of few spares of the Casio 445nm diodes... they might not be around too long. But don't be a fool and invest in them for some fancy laser design unless your time to market is immediate.

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I think this sums it up perfectly.

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Originally Posted by JohnYayas

For now, buy of few spares of the Casio 445nm diodes... But don't be a fool and invest in them for some fancy laser design unless your time to market is immediate.

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Outstanding advice. :)

Within a year (and probably a lot sooner than that) I'm certain that we will see several commercial laser modules based on these diodes. (We're already starting to see some on E-bay, though none from any of the big manufacturers - yet.) So even if you're not a do-it-yourself wiz, you'll soon have an affordable off-the-shelf solution available to you.

And yeah - longer term we may very well see newer diodes with better beam specs, making it foolish to hoard a bunch of these diodes now. (Unless you have a specific use in mind for them already.)

Adam

445's are showing up with laser projector manufactures but not sure if they are Casio.

http://x-laser.com/displaylaser.fwx?...aser=v06X22303

I can't speculate that they are from the Casio projectors but I believe x-laser put these into market just after.



250mW 455nm Infinity Sapphire Blue Laser.



Off topic if they did use the diodes from the Casio are companies able to called them something different like Sapphire Blue Laser?

I am in no trying to turn this into a bitch thread of arguments but I am curious. If I had a laser projector company I would be doing the same thing given the price drop.

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Off topic if they did use the diodes from the Casio are companies able to called them something different like Sapphire Blue Laser

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Of course they can, otherwise most of our heads would be 'Nichia Something'

Car companies use other peoples engines all the time without having to use the branding.

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Originally Posted by Mattatya

445's are showing up with laser projector manufactures but not sure if they are Casio.

http://x-laser.com/displaylaser.fwx?...aser=v06X22303

I can't speculate that they are from the Casio projectors but I believe x-laser put these into market just after.


250mW 455nm Infinity Sapphire Blue Laser.



Off topic if they did use the diodes from the Casio are companies able to called them something different like Sapphire Blue Laser?

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If they buy the diodes wholesale (fx. from the same supplier Casio gets them), they can call the lasers anything they want, as long as they're not infringing on anybody else's trademarks.

Honestly, I doubt these companies would buy entire Casio projectors and pull diodes from them, instead, tracing down the original supplier of the components and buying the diodes from there is a lot easier in large quantities.

I am a bit surprised by the power rating: 250mW is quite on the low end considering the research we've done on what power ratings these diodes can handle CW. However, 445nm Nichias are a lot more expensive.

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250mW is quite on the low end considering the research we've done on what power ratings these diodes can handle CW. However, 445nm Nichias are a lot more expensive.

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I thought the same thing but thought they are doing so in order to make these available without a variance.

Also, one small but significant detail I think we've missed

X-laser are advertising 455nm not 445nm, so unlikely these are the Casio diodes.

I'm quite surprised really that the diode manufacturer hasn't started offering these to laser companies and individuals direct anyway.

Surely they must realise the enormity of the market for these at a fair price which considering Casio are incorporating them in another product with the associated cost, this must mean extra profits for the manufacturer going direct. After all Casio will be making a profit, so by selling them direct at "projector breakage cost", the manufacturer will make more profit themselves whilst maintaining overall sales.

Oh Shit norty303

Good eye lol. I take everything back. Dan really should be using the 445's though if he can get them from the source. Or even the Casio's for that matter.

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Originally Posted by norty303

Also, one small but significant detail I think we've missed

X-laser are advertising 455nm not 445nm, so unlikely these are the Casio diodes.

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Is there even a source that does 455nm lasers? OPSL perhaps, but unlikely. If it's a DPSS, then it's 457, or it's a diode, in which case it's 445nm. Typos like this are quite common on Chinese web sites trying to translate into Engrish. ;)

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I'm quite surprised really that the diode manufacturer hasn't started offering these to laser companies and individuals direct anyway.

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Large companies offering these to individuals is not going to happen any time soon, simply because the amount of components they'll sell to said individuals is going to be way under their sales threshold. Maintaining records for every single client who orders ONE diode is going to be such a pain in the butt that most manufacturers won't bother.

Getting these things wholesale or to a module manufacturer in larger quantities is more of a likely option. One can always buy that single diode from a wholesale or mail order retailer if they want to.

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Originally Posted by norty303

Also, one small but significant detail I think we've missed

X-laser are advertising 455nm not 445nm, so unlikely these are the Casio diodes.

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na I think they make those numbers up... they were selling their 405 stuff as 415 IIRC

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Typos like this are quite common on Chinese web sites trying to translate into Engrish.

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Hmm, but isn't X-laser very much an American run company? He certainly seems to have a very good grasp of English when he posts here.

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Is there even a source that does 455nm lasers? OPSL perhaps, but unlikely. If it's a DPSS, then it's 457, or it's a diode, in which case it's 445nm.

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Isn't that splitting hairs a little, given the variation found on diodes due to temp, etc? E.g. the 445's spectrographed nearer 440, the 642's sold at 640, etc I'm not sure many diode sources are bang on the money. Does that mean every 455nm source that comes up through Googling is actually mislabelled?

I guess the easiest way to clarify this is to ask X-laser directly....

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Originally Posted by norty303

Hmm, but isn't X-laser very much an American run company? He certainly seems to have a very good grasp of English when he posts here.

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It's an American Laser company, and i'm pretty sure Dan knows what he is doing. Check out Buffo's review of X-Lasers operation.

http://www.photonlexicon.com/forums/...er-s-operation

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Originally Posted by buffo

Outstanding advice. :)

Within a year (and probably a lot sooner than that) I'm certain that we will see several commercial laser modules based on these diodes. (We're already starting to see some on E-bay, though none from any of the big manufacturers - yet.) So even if you're not a do-it-yourself wiz, you'll soon have an affordable off-the-shelf solution available to you.

And yeah - longer term we may very well see newer diodes with better beam specs, making it foolish to hoard a bunch of these diodes now. (Unless you have a specific use in mind for them already.)

Adam

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Not to correct you Adam but rather to interject, these 445 modules are now being sold commercially by Kvant. CNI also recently sent out a new list of RGB modules featuring 445's as the blue source.

https://www.ctlasers.com/purchases/p...s-c-42_45.html

Yay Marc for getting Kvant! *DZ

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Originally Posted by flecom

na I think they make those numbers up... they were selling their 405 stuff as 415 IIRC

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That was a typo on some early ad material, and they corrected it. (Though I have seen as high as 411 nm out of a blu-ray diode, but it's only the off-spec ones that do that.)

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Originally Posted by norty303

Hmm, but isn't X-laser very much an American run company? He certainly seems to have a very good grasp of English when he posts here.

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Yeah, they're based in Washington DC.

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Isn't that splitting hairs a little, given the variation found on diodes due to temp, etc? E.g. the 445's spectrographed nearer 440, the 642's sold at 640, etc I'm not sure many diode sources are bang on the money. Does that mean every 455nm source that comes up through Googling is actually mislabelled?

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Maybe it's a typo, maybe it's marketing embellishment, or maybe they do exhibit some spectral drift from one diode to the next.

I should also point out that X-laser has been selling 445 nm lasers for years. Their higher-end RGB projectors (1 watt and up) all use Nichia diodes. (I saw one in operation when I toured their facility back in May of this year.)

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Originally Posted by Andrew/DLS

Not to correct you Adam but rather to interject, these 445 modules are now being sold commercially by Kvant. CNI also recently sent out a new list of RGB modules featuring 445's as the blue source.

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Thanks for that info! I knew that Kvant also sold 445 nm lasers,but I didn't know they were using the cheaper diodes that can be found in the casio projectors. That explains the drastic reduction in price! (If memory serves, just a few months ago a 1 watt 445 nm laser from Kvant would have cost north of $3,000...)

So yeah, quite a bit less than a year to wait! *retardo

Adam