And before we did lasers...we did Light Boxes...

Background:

Back in '73 or so, I had a electrical engineer roommate that worked at TI. One evening he brought home what he described as the coolest thing he couldn't pass up from Neiman Marcus, a posh store in Dallas. He took it out of the bag and plugged it in. It was a white cube, about 10" on a side, solid on all 5 sides except the front, which had square cut-outs in three partitions, front to back. Each cut-out in the next partition toward the back got smaller. All cut-outs were centered on the center line of the box. It started flashing colors in each partition. And it looked very cool. I had to make one, but better. So I did, and this is what it looks like when you play music to it. The color changes are all random.

As an aside: I saw in another thread where it was discussed on YouTube would take down a posted video if it used commercial music. I've never had YouTube do more than provide an initial warning followed by, "your okay". I do not monetize any of my YouTube posts and maybe that is a factor, nor do I have a lot of "views". So well see from this post what happens.

Here it is, and I will post another of my laser YouTube vids in Laser Displays...shortly, that ties in with my thread "In the old days...this is what we did"

So here is light box magic. Doing one with DMX controls would be very cool (and I started building one back in 2017...sigh) but now I've diverted to exploring Programmable RGB LED strips.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxPTgUdgGjA

Here is another example done at the same time as the first one, done to Steve Miller's "Abracadabra":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6dNdHpxqgw&t=75s

That's pretty neat! Reminds me of the lighted dance floors that were so popular in bars and nightclubs in the 70's and 80's. (I even remember one being installed on the wall at the local roller skating rink back when I was in High School!)

Do you have any pictures of the inside of the box? Trying to figure out how the lights are arranged.

Thinking that you could re-create this today with some smart LED strip lights arranged in a circle around the inside edge of each "mask" layer. It would be easy to drive them with an Arduino to get a "color organ" effect that followed the music, but it should be just as simple to drive it via DMX. You'd want some sort of a diffuser on the lights of course. And maybe have a translucent plastic layer that extends inward from the mask edge to soften the colors even more? (That plastic would end up being the display surface for the colors seen from the front for each layer.)

Hmmm. I just happened to purchase a pair of 6 meter smart LED strips last week so I could experiment with them. Should be more than enough! I think this would be a fun little project to try. :)

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

That's pretty neat! Reminds me of the lighted dance floors that were so popular in bars and nightclubs in the 70's and 80's. (I even remember one being installed on the wall at the local roller skating rink back when I was in High School!)

Do you have any pictures of the inside of the box? Trying to figure out how the lights are arranged.

Thinking that you could re-create this today with some smart LED strip lights arranged in a circle around the inside edge of each "mask" layer. It would be easy to drive them with an Arduino to get a "color organ" effect that followed the music, but it should be just as simple to drive it via DMX. You'd want some sort of a diffuser on the lights of course. And maybe have a translucent plastic layer that extends inward from the mask edge to soften the colors even more? (That plastic would end up being the display surface for the colors seen from the front for each layer.)

Hmmm. I just happened to purchase a pair of 6 meter smart LED strips last week so I could experiment with them. Should be more than enough! I think this would be a fun little project to try. :)

Adam

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We think alike, Adam. I purchased various LED strips a few years ago and Arduino. Made some progress and then got other priorities to deal with. I'm not sure a diffuser would be required as that is the purpose of the flat-white partitions. The inside of the box is flat-white everywhere.

In this version the lights are 110VAC RYGB flashing Christmas tree lights, the old style, with self-taping sockets on 110vac zip cord in a corner of each partition. The zip cord is one length, in a spiral-like fashion from the front of the 1st section to the last, finally exiting the box and terminated with a plug. No fuse. (Be careful). Simple, yet elegant.

I have photos some where, still looking...found them Attachment 56690

Let's colaborate...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

We think alike, Adam. I purchased various LED strips a few years ago and Arduino. Made some progress and then got other priorities to deal with. I'm not sure a diffuser would be required as that is the purpose of the flat-white partitions. The inside of the box is flat-white everywhere.

In this version the lights are 110VAC RYGB flashing Christmas tree lights, the old style, with self-taping sockets on 110vac zip cord in a corner of each partition. The zip cord is one length, in a spiral-like fashion from the front of the 1st section to the last, finally exiting the box and terminated with a plug. No fuse. (Be careful). Simple, yet elegant.

I have photos some where, still looking...found them Attachment 56690

Let's colaborate...

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I remember building a circuit with filters that I'd plug my stereo speaker wire into and it would flash 3 different colors based on the music. It seems really cool but a little impractical to leave sitting in my room. Jump to now where I don't have things that are a little impractical, I have a things that are a LOT impractical. :) Once a nerd, always a nerd.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JohnYayas

I remember building a circuit with filters that I'd plug my stereo speaker wire into and it would flash 3 different colors based on the music. It seems really cool but a little impractical to leave sitting in my room. Jump to now where I don't have things that are a little impractical, I have a things that are a LOT impractical. :) Once a nerd, always a nerd.

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:good::good::good:

What's the saying? "He with the most toys when he dies, wins." I just want to be a contender. :o

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

We think alike, Adam. I purchased various LED strips a few years ago and Arduino. Made some progress and then got other priorities to deal with. I'm not sure a diffuser would be required as that is the purpose of the flat-white partitions. The inside of the box is flat-white everywhere.

In this version the lights are 110VAC RYGB flashing Christmas tree lights, the old style, with self-taping sockets on 110vac zip cord in a corner of each partition. The zip cord is one length, in a spiral-like fashion from the front of the 1st section to the last, finally exiting the box and terminated with a plug. No fuse. (Be careful). Simple, yet elegant.

I have photos some where, still looking...found them Attachment 56690

Let's colaborate...

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Looking back over my notes on a DMX equivalent solution, I concluded that the number of DMX channels required to have the same level of 'programmable' variability as the existing C-7 bulb configuration would be 1 channel of RGB LED's for each existing C-7 bulb, or 4 DMX channels times the number of box baffles. In the case of 5 baffles that translates to 20 DMX channels.

If you have any questions about how to wire, control or set up your LED's, I am more than happy to help.

It is kinda my thing. I work as a Disney contractor for Kiteman Productions. Although with Covid-19 probably not for much longer since the show is not running and has no resume date.

Jump to 4:00 and then to 7:48 to see my LED's used in the EPCOT Forever night time show on kites.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhRqJCkYQ-U

Chris

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Originally Posted by Lazerjock

If you have any questions about how to wire, control or set up your LED's, I am more than happy to help.

It is kinda my thing. I work as a Disney contractor for Kiteman Productions. Although with Covid-19 probably not for much longer since the show is not running and has no resume date.

Jump to 4:00 and then to 7:48 to see my LED's used in the EPCOT Forever night time show on kites.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhRqJCkYQ-U

Chris

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Very cool kite effect Chris! Thanks for sharing the video and the offer for help. It took me a while to see how the kites were being flown. Great effect!

I've been reviewing the many, many channel controllers...and there are a ton of them out their. Any recommendations? At a minimum a 5 channel controller could be used, but I see using shorter LED ribbons, 4 per section x 5 sections, or 20 channels max.

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

Very cool kite effect Chris! Thanks for sharing the video and the offer for help. It took me a while to see how the kites were being flown. Great effect!



Thank you for the compliments. The kites are being pulled by wave runners. This gives us the ability to fly in any direction regardless of wind speed or direction.


I've been reviewing the many, many channel controllers...and there are a ton of them out their. Any recommendations? At a minimum a 5 channel controller could be used, but I see using shorter LED ribbons, 4 per section x 5 sections, or 20 channels max.

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I need to know more about what you are trying to accomplish. I've read all of the posts in this thread and watched the video.
If you are not committed to DMX control there are a couple other method that are much easier and I believe more versitile.

1. A simple audio controller for WS28xx LED's. Its called the SP106E. I have one and it works like a next generation color organ. Cheap too.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SP106E-Musi...kAAOSw4ChdeNbO

2. Arduino controller driving the same LED's (WS28xx). It would be based on the Arduino Nano or equivalent. They are only a few dollars. The trick is you will need to do the programming to accomplish what you want, but the sky is the limit.

If you are not familiar with the WS28xx series of LED's, they are addressable LED's. Some refer to them as smart LED's. With the proper controller the LED's can each be controlled in intensity and color. Typically up to 2048 LED's in a single string. Depending on the length, the strings can be wired in parallel and split multiple times without a data booster.

I don't want to hi-jack your thread. PM me if you need more info.

Chris

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Originally Posted by Lazerjock

I need to know more about what you are trying to accomplish. I've read all of the posts in this thread and watched the video.
If you are not committed to DMX control there are a couple other method that are much easier and I believe more versitile.

1. A simple audio controller for WS28xx LED's. Its called the SP106E. I have one and it works like a next generation color organ. Cheap too.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SP106E-Musi...kAAOSw4ChdeNbO

2. Arduino controller driving the same LED's (WS28xx). It would be based on the Arduino Nano or equivalent. They are only a few dollars. The trick is you will need to do the programming to accomplish what you want, but the sky is the limit.

If you are not familiar with the WS28xx series of LED's, they are addressable LED's. Some refer to them as smart LED's. With the proper controller the LED's can each be controlled in intensity and color. Typically up to 2048 LED's in a single string. Depending on the length, the strings can be wired in parallel and split multiple times without a data booster.

I don't want to hi-jack your thread. PM me if you need more info.

Chris

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I haven't decided what I want to achieve other than programmable lights. SP106E looks like something that would be fun to play with (and I'll probably buy one just to have) but I'm tending toward individual or individual groups within the string of LEDs to be independently programmable. Like I said earlier, I started investigating various ways to upgrade this old light box, time passes, memory fades, so I'm re-visiting this. I've download the WS28xx datasheet, now this is exactly the kind of thing what I want as a light source.

I have an Arduino Nano that I will need to re-familiarize myself with. My inclination is toward being able to program light sequences to specific pieces of music and easily upload different routines.

Just watched this YT tutorial on LED strip comparisons and found it terrifically enlightening: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnvircC22hU

Thanks again for the suggestions and insights...feel free to hijack this thread as much as you want, too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

I haven't decided what I want to achieve other than programmable lights. SP106E looks like something that would be fun to play with (and I'll probably buy one just to have) but I'm tending toward individual or individual groups within the string of LEDs to be independently programmable. Like I said earlier, I started investigating various ways to upgrade this old light box, time passes, memory fades, so I'm re-visiting this. I've download the WS28xx datasheet, now this is exactly the kind of thing what I want as a light source.

I have an Arduino Nano that I will need to re-familiarize myself with. My inclination is toward being able to program light sequences to specific pieces of music and easily upload different routines.

Just watched this YT tutorial on LED strip comparisons and found it terrifically enlightening: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnvircC22hU

Thanks again for the suggestions and insights...feel free to hijack this thread as much as you want, too.

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I just watched the video. He nailed it! Glad you are inspired to do some LED design. It's a lot of fun.
Keep us updated on your progress on the light box.

You may want to look at getting an SP105E controller too. They are more for manual control, but may be usable for some of your future applications.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bluetooth-S...EAAOSw-V1b-wy7

Chris


Let me know if you have any other questions.

Thus far, I've played around with the SP106E enough to know that it makes a good place to start but I do not plan to stop there. Having multiple sections of programmable LED strings just begs for far more "magic". The Arduino Uno is a great test bed for serial LED programming and makes one lust for "uno mas" such as a Rasberry Pi.

(Edit: I had to correct image downloads of these next four)
Attachment 58319 Attachment 58320
Attachment 58321 Attachment 58323

Almost ready to add the LED strips into each Light Box V2 sections.
Attachment 58322

more later

Very cool! I'm assuming that you've reprogrammed the SP106e so that a single "pixel" is actually a sequence of LEDs just long enough to go around the inside of each section in the light box, right? That way when they are set to pulse to the music, each section will be a different color?

I played around with this idea back in the spring, but now I'm torn... I can't decide if I want to just take the easy route and use the SP106e (or another, similar controller), or if I want to hook up an Arduino and use that to control the LEDs. The Arduino option is attractive to me because it will force me to learn more about C++, which is a language that I'm not all that familiar with, but it will also take up a lot more of my free time. Decisions, decisions...

By the way, love the vintage Apple IIe computer in the background! :)

Adam

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Originally Posted by buffo

Very cool! I'm assuming that you've reprogrammed the SP106e so that a single "pixel" is actually a sequence of LEDs just long enough to go around the inside of each section in the light box, right? That way when they are set to pulse to the music, each section will be a different color?

I played around with this idea back in the spring, but now I'm torn... I can't decide if I want to just take the easy route and use the SP106e (or another, similar controller), or if I want to hook up an Arduino and use that to control the LEDs. The Arduino option is attractive to me because it will force me to learn more about C++, which is a language that I'm not all that familiar with, but it will also take up a lot more of my free time. Decisions, decisions...

By the way, love the vintage Apple IIe computer in the background! :)

Adam

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Thanks Adam, I'm glad to be heading toward "something". I wouldn't even know how to go about reprogramming whatever is used in the SP106E. None of the chips have ANY identification marks. My first test will be simply to series-connect each LED string from partition-to-partition and attach the SP106E to a long "input" lead that will stick out of the back of the box so the controller can be out from behind the box near some audio speakers. I've made a number of design variations for how many LED nodes are on a given partition string but first I'm just going with the KISS principle, then try variations from there. Like you, getting more experience with C++ sounds like fun, but my primary long-term focus is to be able to choose a piece of music and program the "LED Magic Box" results to complement what is happening in the music.

Ah yes, ye ol' Apple IIe. It's my other time-task involving creating new graphics along with some of my old library of laser images to choreograph, animate and video new stuff that highlights its RGB capabilities.

Here is the inside of the SP106E:
Attachment 58324

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

I wouldn't even know how to go about reprogramming whatever is used in the SP106E.

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Sorry - poor choice of words on my part. By "reprogramming", I meant the configuration profile for the "LED Chord" app on your phone that can be used to control the SP106e. That's where you tell it the specifics of the LED string that is connected to the controller.

One of the settings in the configuration section deals with how many LEDs constitute one "pixel". (It's where you set the total number of LEDs per string.) On the first set of LEDs I bought, you could not change the color of every LED individually, because each color chip was wired to drive three LEDs. So you had to remember to set the number of LEDs per pixel to 3 or else it wouldn't work correctly. But you could also INCREASE this setting if you wanted, and by doing so you could make larger segments of the string act in unison.

My thought was to adjust this setting so that I had all of the LEDs in a given section of the light box set up to be a single pixel. That way they would all be the same color.

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

Sorry - poor choice of words on my part. By "reprogramming", I meant the configuration profile for the "LED Chord" app on your phone that can be used to control the SP106e. That's where you tell it the specifics of the LED string that is connected to the controller.

One of the settings in the configuration section deals with how many LEDs constitute one "pixel". (It's where you set the total number of LEDs per string.) On the first set of LEDs I bought, you could not change the color of every LED individually, because each color chip was wired to drive three LEDs. So you had to remember to set the number of LEDs per pixel to 3 or else it wouldn't work correctly. But you could also INCREASE this setting if you wanted, and by doing so you could make larger segments of the string act in unison.

My thought was to adjust this setting so that I had all of the LEDs in a given section of the light box set up to be a single pixel. That way they would all be the same color.

Adam

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I'm like whuh? An LED app I can use on my phone? Thanks for clueing me in. So the native SP106E RF remote is Bluetooth based? Edit: Nay, the SP105E is though. Is this the LED Chord app by spledapps? I'll definitely check it out.

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

So the native SP106E RF remote is Bluetooth based? Edit: Nay, the SP105E is though.

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I bought several controllers in that series, including the 105, the 106, the 107, and the 108. Some supported Bluetooth, some supported WiFi, and some supported both protocols, but I don't remember the details of each one. I'm pretty sure I had settled on using the 107 controller though - at least up to the point where I started looking into the Arduino. Once I started thinking about using the Arduino, it opened up a ton of new possibilities, and as a result the whole project just sort of stalled...

The prototype build is still sitting on a shelf in the garage. It's not painted, and the LED strips aren't even mounted permanently (just held in with the sticky-back tape), but I was able to get it to work as intended, so I know that the core concept is sound. I just need to get off my ass, make a decision about control, finish the prototype, and then build another one using nicer materials. (Already have the wood for the final version sitting in the garage.)

Once thing I was considering was to add some sort of diffuser to the LED strips to smooth out the light a bit. But so far all of the commercial plastic diffusers I've tried (the ones you can buy for fluorescent light fixtures) don't seem to work very well.

I'm also on the fence about how to construct the box. Since you need to be able to remove the top (or the bottom) to assemble everything, I had originally thought about mitering the edges on a 45 degree angle using my table saw, but looking at your build with the notched edge on the top plate is making me reconsider things.

Finally, I'm torn between two basic design options: do I build this as a light fixture only, or should I include a speaker? Adding a speaker makes it more practical, and it also simplifies the audio-input to the controller, but now I have to worry about vibration. Sigh. I guess I'm suffering from analysis paralysis...

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Is this the LED Chord app by spledapps? I'll definitely check it out.

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Yes, LED Chord by spledapps is the app I was using on my phone. I know it works with the 107 controller, but I don't know if it supports any of the others. One caveat: you must give the app permission to know your location, or else it will lock up. And if you want to use the audio from your phone as the source for the sound-reactive effects, you have to give the app permission to control phone calls and to access files on your SD card. But once you enable all the permissions, the app works pretty well.

There is another app that also works with at least some of these controllers. It's called LED Shop, and it's also from splendapps. I think this is the first app I tried, so it's probably the one that was originally designed for the 105 or 106 controller. Not sure if it will work with any of the later controllers in the series or not, but it's probably worth trying. Remember to set the permissions when you first launch it, or it will lock up just like the LED Chord app.

Adam

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I bought several controllers in that series, including the 105, the 106, the 107, and the 108. Some supported Bluetooth, some supported WiFi, and some supported both protocols,

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Thanks for your information sharing. I've looked at those as well (but like a year ago), bought the 106, played with it, know how it works and forgot about the others until I reviewed them again last night.

Personally, I very much dislike and distrust 3rd party smartphone apps because of the liberal (imho) permissions they require. That is why I'm drawn to using an Arduino or even the Apple IIe as a programmable LED strip controller. I downloaded the LED Chord and installed it last night but have decided not to use it. I want what is controlling the LEDs to be hardwired to the box since it is just a serial communications line, GND and +5 or +12v.

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I was considering was to add some sort of diffuser to the LED strips to smooth out the light a bit.

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I found the waterproof WS2811 or 12's strips provide some light diffusion although using them makes it a hassle cutting strips to length and re-soldering connector leads on both ends. I haven't completely worked out how I'm mounting the strips...I just know they will be removable, changeable.

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I'm also on the fence about how to construct the box.

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I found a wooden (plywood, particle board, etc.) four sided cube with sides attached via rabbeted and glued edges, with the top side press fitted and removable made it the most utilitarian. I couldn't find the fine, 3/8" particle board like I used in the early '70s so I went with 3/8" birch plywood this time around, except these days all the lumber we buy is thinner than advertised. This birch ply is .35" thick, but has a nice fine grain for an easy, smooth finish. I did the rabbet cuts on my table saw with rip fence, using dado blades that my dad bought back in the late '50s, but had long debates on whether to use my DIY CNC machine. I created the CAM and Gerber machining files for the entire box and partitions including different partition geometric cut-out shapes. In the end I went with the table saw since I could do ALL the box and blank partition cutting in less than 2 hours which was far faster than the CNC machine could do. I made the partition slots on the inside edges using the dado blades and the rip fence. These new partitions are mostly clear .095" polycarbonate with one Acrylic partition from scrap. The circle cut-outs I'm doing on the CNC in the next few days, then will spray paint them flat white on both sides.

I believe I mentioned in this original post that I used 1/8" white illustration board for the partitions, cutting them each out of the 36" x 36" cardboard with a mat knife. It was quick and easy and required no painting since they were white on one side and a very light green on the other. Since the inside of the completed box was spray painted flat white that provided ample light diffusing along with each partition's white side.

From the start, I wanted the partitions to be "slide-in" so I could easily change them out, slightly oversized dado slots did the trick. An easier way to accomplish this if making dados is not practical is to use small parallel strips of 1/4" wood (or anything) and tack or glue onto each side to create the "slots". Its labor intensive but doesn't require dado blades or CNC machining.

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Finally, I'm torn between two basic design options: do I build this as a light fixture only, or should I include a speaker?

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My take is that as a light fixture only, I can set the box "in concert with" any speaker setup I may choose, large or small.


...Then I keep wondering, will I ever get to starting much less finishing my DIY 1W DT40 RGB laser projector w/Lumia and diffraction wheel effects???

EDIT: Did I mention in the earlier post that I originally used an adjustable, radial-arm hole cutter attachment for my drill press to cut out the holes in the illustration board? In fact, I believe the smallest hole size the cutter could be adjusted to determined the last and smallest partition hole size. The other holes where proportionally larger from that. I'm glad I don't have those limitations today ;-)

Here is a top view of the V2 box showing the polycarbonate partitions sitting in their dado slots. The protective skin is still on each partition but will come off when I machine their centered holes. I really prefer using Acrylic sheets for the partitions but I found them hard to find during the pandemic. I still paid a premium for the small amount of polycarbonate material having instead to buy it from a local plastic sign fabricator's scrap pile.

I've abandoned entirely the idea of using DMX and it may be obvious in these most recent threads. My choice is the WS2812B 60" strips purchased from BTF-Lighting that I'll cut down into sections and series wire them together w/female-to-male connectors connecting the section LED strips.

Attachment 58325

Next, I'm doing some CNC milling on the plastic partitions, then add the lights.

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

I very much dislike and distrust 3rd party smartphone apps because of the liberal (imho) permissions they require. That is why I'm drawn to using an Arduino.

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Yup. 100% agree.

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I haven't completely worked out how I'm mounting the strips.

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I was considering mounting the strips in some aluminum U-channel, and then attaching the channel to the box... That way when you pulled the lid (or the base) off, you would still have something supporting the strip that was spanning the gap. I figured I could easily add a strip of frosted plastic to the top of the U-channel to help diffuse the light...

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I found a wooden (plywood, particle board, etc.) four sided cube with sides attached via rabbeted and glued edges, with the top side press fitted and removable made it the most utilitarian.

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Did not even consider a press-fit lid. Interesting idea! Hmmm...

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I did the rabbet cuts on my table saw with rip fence

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I also used my table saw to cut the slots in the wood frame for my prototype, but since I don't have a dado blade I just made multiple side-by-side cuts to get the kerf wide enough to slide the panels in place. It sucked having to make tiny adjustments to the rip fence though. (My table saw is really cheap!) Also, I used 1/10th inch thick plywood for the panels, rather than the plastic ones you did. As for the holes in the panels, the originals were cut with a jigsaw, but I hated the results, so I bought a complete set of large-diameter hole-saws (up to 6" diameter), and I plan to use those for the next version. (Well, except for the largest hole - that one will probably still need to be cut by hand with the jigsaw.)

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I originally used an adjustable, radial-arm hole cutter attachment for my drill press to cut out the holes in the illustration board

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Huh... I've never even heard of such a thing! Got pics?

My drill press is tiny (it's a Harbor Freight special), so I don't think I'd have enough clearance from the center of the chuck to the support stand at the rear to be able to cut anything larger than ~ a 4 inch radius. But I might be able to pull it off using a handheld drill... :p

Adam

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Originally Posted by buffo

I was considering mounting the strips in some aluminum U-channel, and then attaching the channel to the box... That way when you pulled the lid (or the base) off, you would still have something supporting the strip that was spanning the gap. I figured I could easily add a strip of frosted plastic to the top of the U-channel to help diffuse the light...

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That's not a bad idea, but the U-channel would have to be shallow in order to not cast shadows from it's raised sides, wouldn't it? The waterproof strips (IP 67 rated) provide inherent bridging support plus some diffusing. But my intent is to use the lighter water resistant strips and support each strip at the corners in each baffle just in front of each baffle.

I've designed several methods of mounting the LED strips including open annular rings, the width of a strip, affixed (bonded) to each baffle, with diameters just beyond the line of sight into the box. But the KISS principle has brought me back to just doing open rectangular mountings, with a gap on one side for the in/out leads. Each successive baffle's rectangular strip size "can" be smaller to conserve strip length per baffle (and maybe the smaller hole baffles can get by with fewer LEDs per strip) but each baffle's strip requires input and output leads pigtails in my design. I'll probably just use plastic 4-40 hex stand-offs to support the top two corners of each strip in a baffle. The bottom two corners don't need anything but gravity (imho). I've not yet decided on using strips with 1.3" LED spacing or .65" spacing.

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I just made multiple side-by-side cuts to get the kerf wide enough to slide the panels in place.

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Been there, done that...and for these dados it was simple with circular table saw blades that had 1/8" kerfs. Now you have to search and search for anything larger than 1/16" kerf blades in the 7-1/4 to 8-1/12" diameter range.

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Huh... I've never even heard of such a thing! Got pics?

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My drill press is tiny (it's a Harbor Freight special), so I don't think I'd have enough clearance from the center of the chuck to the support stand at the rear to be able to cut anything larger than ~ a 4 inch radius. But I might be able to pull it off using a handheld drill... :p[/QUOTE]

Here's a radial arm drill (hole cutter) from Rockler but using it with a drill press is an absolute must and should be used to cut the insert hole(s) when they are out of the box. Back in the day, the largest diameter "circular hole cutter" was 2-1/2", primarily used for door latch holes. Now they go up to 5" in diameter but to get anything larger requires the radial arm type...or a CNC machine. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

https://www.rockler.com/mibro-adjust...gaAsVoEALw_wcB

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

That's not a bad idea, but the U-channel would have to be shallow in order to not cast shadows from it's raised sides, wouldn't it? The waterproof strips (IP 67 rated) provide inherent bridging support plus some diffusing. But my intent is to use the lighter water resistant strips and support each strip at the corners in each baffle just in front of each baffle.

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Would this work for your application?
https://www.superbrightleds.com/more...saAtM3EALw_wcB

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

https://www.rockler.com/mibro-adjust...gaAsVoEALw_wcB

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@ Adam I have the same hole saw. If you are careful and go slow you can use a battery powered hand drill.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lazerjock

Would this work for your application?
https://www.superbrightleds.com/more...saAtM3EALw_wcB


@ Adam I have the same hole saw. If you are careful and go slow you can use a battery powered hand drill.

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Laserjock, yeah, those look to be well suited, and there is one that has a curved diffuser that Adam would like. Thanks for the link! Those would be cool for lots of different LED applications.

Edit: I do believe that in the small light box enclosure, bounce lighting is the key to achieving an even intensity on the viewing area. That is the primary reason for painting the inside of the box and both sides of the partitions flat white.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

snip

Edit: I do believe that in the small light box enclosure, bounce lighting is the key to achieving an even intensity on the viewing area. That is the primary reason for painting the inside of the box and both sides of the partitions flat white.

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Okay, I've been watching this for a while and, OMG NO, in a brute force "projector" you want small bare filaments - or small emitters working with LEDs. Forget white walls - think mirrors. White walls are diffusers - you don't want a diffused effect - you want as close to point sources as possible to get some resolution to the effect. If you've got a soft white bulb and it looks lousy, and you've got a clear bulb with a small filament or a filament that's aligned so it looks small to your output panel - and it looks awesome - there's a lesson to be learnt...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laserist

Okay, I've been watching this for a while and, OMG NO, in a brute force "projector" you want small bare filaments - or small emitters working with LEDs. Forget white walls - think mirrors. White walls are diffusers - you don't want a diffused effect - you want as close to point sources as possible to get some resolution to the effect. If you've got a soft white bulb and it looks lousy, and you've got a clear bulb with a small filament or a filament that's aligned so it looks small to your output panel - and it looks awesome - there's a lesson to be learnt...

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I agree, but please don't take me so literally. The LEDs do mimic the point-source filament.

Thanks for the link to superbrightleds.com, Chris! They have several sizes of aluminum channel (including one with a diffuser) that I think will work really well.

The reason I'm thinking of using the diffuser is because I'm after a smooth, consistent color intensity across the entire circle. Right now I can see the hot spots formed by the individual LED emitters, and that is not the effect I'm looking for. I suppose if I were using mirrored sheets instead of thin plywood that is painted white, I might see different results, but I'm not ready to try cutting large diameter circles in sheets of mirrored glass...

Speaking of drilling those large diameter circles, my hole-saw kit has bits that range from 1" to 6" in diameter, which isn't any larger than what you can get with that adjustable radius cutting tool. The hole in the front plate on my design needs to be 8.75 inches in diameter, so it looks like I'll need to do that one with the jigsaw again.

Although, after a bit more searching, I did find a similar adjustable hole-cutting tool that was designed for sheetrock... It goes all the way up to a 16 inch diameter hole, which is great, but it's completely manual, so that sucks. Still, I could probably use one of these to cut the thin plywood if I worked at it, but it would be slow going.

Decisions, decisions!

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

, but I'm not ready to try cutting large diameter circles in sheets of mirrored glass...

Adam

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Don't think "mirror" literally, think reflectively, strategically.

Wow, 8.75" diameter. I love it.

Adam and Steve's comments have really put a fire under my ass to get some practical testing done. My heart felt thanks to you two, and to lazerjock as well whose valuable input and insights got this ball rolling. Edit: Sadly, in the process I burnt out most of a WB2812B 5v strip of 44 RGB LEDs...boo...hiss.

I am really excited and greatly encouraged by my first results both visually and with digital video recording simply using a cheap controller. The vast possibilities with fairly simple variations on how the LED strip light box components associate with each other blow my mind!

Once I've done a few more digital video tests of a single partition I post the link to my YouTube channel here.

(whoooohoo)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

Although, after a bit more searching, I did find a similar adjustable hole-cutting tool that was designed for sheetrock... It goes all the way up to a 16 inch diameter hole, which is great, but it's completely manual, so that sucks. Still, I could probably use one of these to cut the thin plywood if I worked at it, but it would be slow going.

Decisions, decisions!

Adam

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Adam,
If you have a router you can make a jig to cut circles easily.

https://www.thisoldhouse.com/house-o...g-for-a-router

If you don't have a router. Time to visit Harbor Freight.

https://www.harborfreight.com/electr...ool-42831.html

I have a router, but it's huge. (2.5 HP) I think something like a Roto-Zip would be more appropriate for the jig you linked to. (Remember that the stuff we're cutting is only 1/8 inch thick or less.)

The Harbor Freight tool is cheap enough that I might just give it a shot though.

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

I have a router, but it's huge. (2.5 HP) I think something like a Roto-Zip would be more appropriate for the jig you linked to. (Remember that the stuff we're cutting is only 1/8 inch thick or less.)

The Harbor Freight tool is cheap enough that I might just give it a shot though.

Adam

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A Dremel tool would work fine as well.

I do have a Dremel tool... (I actually have two of them.) But I don't have the ring-attachment that clamps to the body to hold it vertical like a router. I'm guessing that by the time I purchase that ring-base adapter thingy I will have spent nearly as much as that cheap knock-off tool from Harbor Freight.

Plus, it's always nice to have another power tool cluttering up the workbench! :)

Adam

Too many tools!!??
Never!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Lazerjock

Too many tools!!??
Never!!!!!!

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Wow! I wish my workbench looked that nice!

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

Wow! I wish my workbench looked that nice!

Adam

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Me too!
Someday maybe

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lazerjock

Too many tools!!??
Never!!!!!!

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That's disgusting, having so many tools in just one room. :-)

Here is a short video test that replicates the projection throw distance in my RGB LED Light Box. LED spacing is about .65", (Edit: projection distance to white piece of printer paper, about 1.875"). This is the same projection distance (or partition separation distance) as my original Light Box. There is a penny in the frame for size reference. The lighter color below the penny location is from dim room lighting. I have comments in the YouTube video description.

I'm pleased with the smooth blending of color on the projection surface when all LEDs are the same hue, not so thrilled with the resulting intensity but it is not a game changer. No doubt there are brighter strips but at what cost $$ and controller overhead.

https://youtu.be/OoqLFt-0pYc

Here are some stills of the same view of solid colors showing very nice homogeneity across a 10" span.

Attachment 58474

Attachment 58475

Attachment 58476

Attachment 58477

Attachment 58478

Next, I have a bunch of tedious soldering of the strip sections for each partition section to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

Here is a short video test that replicates the projection throw distance in my RGB LED Light Box. LED spacing is about .65", (Edit: projection distance to white piece of printer paper, about 1.875"). This is the same projection distance (or partition separation distance) as my original Light Box. There is a penny in the frame for size reference. The lighter color below the penny location is from dim room lighting. I have comments in the YouTube video description.

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Correction: Projection distance from the LED strip to white piece of paper should be 1.625", not 1.875".

So I will redo the video and static RYGB photos at the correct distance and add as an edit to this post, soon. This is good news as it should reflect an increased reflected light intensities.

Here is a better video test using the proper LED-to-reflective surface distance of 1.625". In the photo below you will notice on the left side a 1" grid strip. Click on the image to enlarge and see the grid strip. The major visible horizontal grid lines are 1" apart. The black Sharpie mark on one division marks the horizontal centerline of the LED strip. From left-to-right, the white area (including the grid strip) is just under 10" wide. The penny is still used in the field of view for size reference purposes.

Attachment 58496


(See YouTube video description for more information)

https://youtu.be/-RdPIq1bl8c

Here is my last LED strip test that "sheds light" on the effectiveness of illumination coverage in a different orientation between the strip and reflective surface.

https://youtu.be/0ISZBUxittg

You always have something very cool you are making.

Very nice.

Partitions milled and lightly sanded for painting. Can't spray paint the partitions with flat white until a day or two of warmer weather comes.
Maybe I can begin soldering the LED strip sections together for each partition.

Attachment 58613

Looking great.
Do you still take orders for light boxes?
__________________________________
Marius
https://ndrelectric.com/category/wraps-linears

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Originally Posted by MariusTitulescu

Looking great.
Do you still take orders for light boxes?
__________________________________
Marius
https://ndrelectric.com/category/wraps-linears

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Thank you.

Well...I've never taken orders but thank you for asking. I've made only three of these boxes, the original one, mine, that I made back in the mid-70's (shown in the YouTube video) , a 2nd one that I gave to my brother about the same time and this one.

Acrylic partitions are now spray painted and ready for the WS2812B segments to be adhered to each partition, then wired in series. (oh that'll be fun...and painstakingly slow)
The top lid is removed for clarity...and the black partition isn't quite seated fully in its slots.

Just from a video filming standpoint I found that with the front section facing the camera painted black it results in the best viewing/filming & color illumination experience. Originally the front partition was flat white on both sides and gave the best aesthetic appearance when off and just sitting on a table.

Attachment 59050

Then there is the programming. But first I'm just going to test it with the SP106E RGB controller and hope that I will be so amazed that I won't need to do program interfacing. But from what I've seen of the SP106E responding to ambient music and endowing the LED strip with it's "control", I doubt it will be what I'm wanting.

very cool looking so far :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

Acrylic partitions are now spray painted and ready for the WS2812B segments to be adhered to each partition, then wired in series. (oh that'll be fun...and painstakingly slow)
The top lid is removed for clarity...and the black partition isn't quite seated fully in its slots.

Just from a video filming standpoint I found that with the front section facing the camera painted black it results in the best viewing/filming & color illumination experience. Originally the front partition was flat white on both sides and gave the best aesthetic appearance when off and just sitting on a table.

Attachment 59050

Then there is the programming. But first I'm just going to test it with the SP106E RGB controller and hope that I will be so amazed that I won't need to do program interfacing. But from what I've seen of the SP106E responding to ambient music and endowing the LED strip with it's "control", I doubt it will be what I'm wanting.

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I build one of these for my son (Dan) last fall and gave it to him as a Christmas present. I've been meaning to put up a post detailing the construction process, but I haven't found the time.

Here is a picture of the completed project:

https://i.imgur.com/dDmqG0a.jpeg

Direct link: https://i.imgur.com/dDmqG0a.jpeg

I used a single 5-meter long strip of WS-2815 RGB LEDs and the SP-107E controller.

When I finally get around to putting the construction post together I will include video of it in action. It's actually pretty damned cool, but building the thing was a huge pain in the ass and it took me a lot longer than I thought it would.

I want to build one for myself, but I've been delaying it because I dread all the work! (Pro tip: Cutting the circles so they are even is *not* as easy as it sounds, and wiring everything up ends up being more than a little frustrating due to how tight everything is.) I agree that the front panel should be painted black for better contrast.

Also, more LEDs are better. The LED strip I used was 16.4 ft long with 300 pixels, but if I make another one I think I will go with the 600 pixel version of the same strip so the output is even brighter. (You can always dim them using the control app on your phone.)

Adam

Quote:

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Originally Posted by buffo

I build one of these for my son (Dan) last fall and gave it to him as a Christmas present. I've been meaning to put up a post detailing the construction process, but I haven't found the time.

Here is a picture of the completed project:
Adam

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That looks really nice, Adam! Can't wait to see some "action videos". The size of my "original box" was dictated by how large of a diameter hole my drill press's sliding-arm circle cutter could cut.

I would agree that the bigger the "box" the more exponential the work to make it is, along with the more il-lumen-ation is required. 300 WS-2815s are a bunch! 600 would be mind-blowing!

I'm glad to see new versions come to "light".

Edit:
In contrast, my first programmable LED WS-2812 version will have only 84 individual RGB diodes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

That looks really nice, Adam! Can't wait to see some "action videos". The size of my "original box" was dictated by how large of a diameter hole my drill press's sliding-arm circle cutter could cut.

I would agree that the bigger the "box" the more exponential the work to make it is, along with the more il-lumen-ation is required. 300 WS-2815s are a bunch! 600 would be mind-blowing!

I'm glad to see new versions come to "light".

Edit:
In contrast, my first programmable LED WS-2812 version will have only 84 individual RGB diodes.

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I found a gel to rgb chart a few years back. Gives 0-255 for rgb to recreate all the Apollo gel sheets. I wanted to recreate my old box where I used gels over bulbs. It was fun coming up with color pallets.

Finally...a number of other projects are done and I'm back on this. I'm wiring it up.

Stay tuned.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lasermaster1977

Finally...a number of other projects are done and I'm back on this. I'm wiring it up.

Stay tuned.

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I was honestly dreading the tediousness and the amount of wiring involved to series connect all the RGB LED sections but pleased I was able to "get 'er done" in an afternoon and evening, today. The big pay-off for doing so today was to see whether the brightness tests I did with the LED strips proved fruitful. Video coming as an addendum to this post after tonight's Yellowstone season opener.

As promised, post Yellowstone season premiere, here is the first test video. Details are noted in YouTube video description. This is an identical dimensioned Light Box as my original and uses programmable RGB LEDs instead of random blinking C7 Christmas light bulbs. The WB2812B LED strip was powered and controlled by an SP106E in Auto mode. A total of 84 individual RGB LEDs are used. My next video test will be using the SP106E in audio control mode just out of curiosity. Even with room lights on, the LED intensity is rather remarkable and gratifying. I hope this lights up your day.

https://youtu.be/JB2Lmp-8fTA

Another photon "toy" to play with and explore computer controlled lighting effects that accompany musical selections.