A little machining and other bits

It's been a while since I have posted any build projects. I thought I'd share some of the upgrade work that I have been doing in regards to my fogscreen. Of course, my fogscreen has been my most ambitious build and the one I'm the most proud of. Over the last few Halloweens, I have noticed how loud the damn thing is. The 120mm fans I used, though cheap when I bought them, were not the best choice. All fans have air noise, that's a given, but the motor noise from these Nidec VA450DC fans is very loud, even at low RPM. These fans are a no-nonsense beast, made for pounding away in a datacenter, keeping racks and devices cool. Quiet operation is not normally of huge concern. I decided to step up to some 140mm jobs that move roughly the same air at a similar static pressure. The fans much quieter, by almost 15 db, especially at a lower RPM, where I typically run them. They also draw 1/3 the current of the Nidec's. A win all around. Those are to be installed soon.

The other bit I'm working on is a dedicated controller. At this time, the fogscreen is set up with a few DMX boards, switches, and relays to make it all work. While it works okay for what I use it for, I want to take a bit more pride in what I have built and also see if there is a more professional way to potentially sell them in a few one-off situations. Arduino came to the rescue. I have always been a big fan of discreet circuitry but I can't deny that there are some projects that would just be too complicated without an MCU. After going through multiple iterations of coding, I finally have a finished controller that will handle everything. This will include the PWM signals to the laminar fans and to the fog fans, the energizing of the ultrasonic misters, to keeping the fog vessel at the correct water level, and filling the fog vessel when the water level gets low. I also incorporated a status screen with the current status as well as any alarms (Loss of DMX signal, Low water in the fill reservoir). The entire thing controlled via DMX for easy programming with BEYOND. The first step was getting the new control panel fabricated.

I have to say, when I bought this little Genmitsu 3020 Pro, I didn't think it was going to be up to the task of milling aluminum. Needless to say, I was quite surprised at how well it did. After milling out the panel, cutting the tabs, and cleaning the oil and chips off, I brought it over to the fiber laser to etch the button labels and my logo. Ready to be install into the fogscreen. Mor updates to come!

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CNC, you lucky bastard. Manual mill here.... ;)

No ultra sharp corners on LCD cutouts for me... :mad:

NICE!!!!

Steve

... not sooo expensive, if you can wait for occasions :cool:

Here my actuall smallest CNC-mill (got it from a friend for 150€ + Touch-PC from another for "exchange")- 200x200x120mm moving space and sturdy enough for some centimeters in aluminium and brass ore some millimeters in steel:

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Originally Posted by mixedgas

CNC, you lucky bastard. Manual mill here.... ;)

No ultra sharp corners on LCD cutouts for me... :mad:

NICE!!!!

Steve

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Thanks. The tightest corner I can get is probably about a 1mm radius. Even then, 2mm end mill bits need some careful feed and plunge rates which I haven't fully cracked yet. I can mill soft alloys without a breakage but if it's a good quality aluminum, changes are good that a bit will break!

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Originally Posted by VDX

... not sooo expensive, if you can wait for occasions :cool:

Here my actuall smallest CNC-mill (got it from a friend for 150€ + Touch-PC from another for "exchange")- 200x200x120mm moving space and sturdy enough for some centimeters in aluminium and brass ore some millimeters in steel:

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Now that's a sexy mill!!!!

... have another, slightly bigger (275x210x210mm moving range) and with servos instead of steppers, which I was using for my laser-development.

Here (last image) both, side by side, for comparison ... and much more machines or components for different configurations :cool:

"Baby Got Back" to quote the song. This pic is the same model as mine, I just don't have the DRO and power feed. Do have the 8" vise and the 14" rotary table.

Manual Machining old style, "This is the way" :rolleyes:

When I talk to professional machinists, I get credit for being able to do my own setups the old way, as they claim it produces greater awareness of the process.

But when you want to clone your design, it takes extra time and practice, and a lot of thinking. R8 tooling is not that expensive, but the cost of End Mills and Good Quality Drill bits has risen through the roof, about 2.5x in the past two years. :mad: Don't get me started on the price of 6061 Aluminum. I'll only use Polish, Slovak, German, or American End Mills. Chinese tooling is so highly variable in quality it is not funny.

Steve

Wow, I must have missed this thread when it was first posted. Great work on that panel, Brian! That would have cost a fortune from Front Panel Express. Not that the fiber laser, mill, and tooling are cheap, of course, but once you've got the gear you can make just about anything for no more than the cost of the material, which is awesome. (My envy is intensifying!)

Regarding the controller, are you sending and receiving DMX directly from the Arduino? I know there are libraries for this, but I seem to recall that there were bandwidth issues with a full universe unless you plugged in a dedicated DMX shield.

Adam

... especially for DIY-panels, beside a CNC-mill you should have a laser too (my youngest asked for someting more "vintage-style")) :cool:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KF_AyG2h8-4

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Originally Posted by buffo

Wow, I must have missed this thread when it was first posted. Great work on that panel, Brian! That would have cost a fortune from Front Panel Express. Not that the fiber laser, mill, and tooling are cheap, of course, but once you've got the gear you can make just about anything for no more than the cost of the material, which is awesome. (My envy is intensifying!)

Regarding the controller, are you sending and receiving DMX directly from the Arduino? I know there are libraries for this, but I seem to recall that there were bandwidth issues with a full universe unless you plugged in a dedicated DMX shield.

Adam

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Thanks, Adam! I agree. Fabrication has always been a pain point for me. I can do it, I just hate it. It's an amalgamation of working with dangerous tools, the fatigue, the mess, and the noise... all of it. Designing in the computer and sending it to <insert fabricator here> to create what you have designed is just priceless. The best part is being able to prototype. I milled three pieces for this, two were for prototyping the third was the finished piece. The first two were out of some really junky PCB that I didn't mind wasting. From there, I tested to make sure everything fit properly and to make sure that the layout would work for my application. Being able to do it all from home may be slow but you have no lead times or potential delivery issues. Also, there is no misunderstanding between designer and fabricator (I'm thinking of Stonehenge from "This is Spinal Tap" LMAO).

For the controller, I'm using an RS485 to TTL decoder and the Conceptinetics Arduino library. I guess it is a shield. It's worked flawlessly so far. I can't believe how cheap it has become to build highly custom controllers. The RS485 decoder was about $4, the Arduino Nano was about $12, and the coding was about two weeks worth of time, writing, testing, improving... If we can keep AI from killing us all, the future of home manufacturing is bright.

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Originally Posted by VDX

... especially for DIY-panels, beside a CNC-mill you should have a laser too

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It's on my radar! Definitely would like to get a 700W~1KW cutter. The problem I'm facing is that most of them are HUGE with large work spaces. I'm starting to see some that are "home garage" sized. I was looking at getting a welder/cutter and using the Langmuir System. It's originally designed for plasma cutting but I've seen plenty of people convert them to use a fiber system.

... what are the materials, you want to laser-cut or otherwise -process?

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Originally Posted by VDX

... what are the materials, you want to laser-cut or otherwise -process?

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Mainly small gauge (less than 3mm) aluminum sheet. Maybe some steel and stainless steel. Again, small gauge. I know aluminum is difficult, given how reflective it is.

... yes, if its 3mm aluminium, then you'll need more than 1.5kW :rolleyes:

For this or thicker parts from aluminium or brass I'm using my CNC-mill ... "thin" metal sheets (steel up to 0.5mm, brass 0.4mm, aluminium 0.1mm) could be "engraving cut" with my 30W fiberlaser with several passes.

Actually building a "laser-cutter" with IR-laserdiode(s) - have some diodes with up to 360W@975nm on a spot of 0.3mm and a box with two 200W-diodes, coupled by a POL-filter ... here the 200W-diodes could be replaced by 310W oder 360W-diodes, as they have the same housing an beam-structure.

The 200W dioses are powerfull enough for 1mm steel, the 360W (or coupled 2x 200W) for up to 2mm ... 2x360W then maybe for 3mm :cool:

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Originally Posted by absolom7691

Designing in the computer and sending it to <insert fabricator here> to create what you have designed is just priceless.

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I'm just getting into 3D printing (my oldest son has been prodding me for years, lol) and I'm starting to understand what you mean here. Of course, my design skills aren't up to the task yet, but the thrill of creation is very real, and with practice you can create just about anything. Milling and laser cutting is just another extension of that creative rush. If laser sintering 3D printers ever become more affordable, I can see that replacing traditional milling for all sorts of pieces parts.

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Being able to do it all from home may be slow but you have no lead times or potential delivery issues. Also, there is no misunderstanding between designer and fabricator (I'm thinking of Stonehenge from "This is Spinal Tap" LMAO).

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"I think the problem may have been that there was a Stonehenge monument on stage that was in danger of being crushed by a dwarf!" :D:D:D

But yeah, whenever you send something off, I'm sure there's always a lingering worry that maybe you forgot to define something correctly. At least at home you get instant feedback, so you catch those mistakes right away.

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For the controller, I'm using an RS485 to TTL decoder and the Conceptinetics Arduino library. I guess it is a shield.

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Yeah, shield or not, it's still an external device that's handling the serial data, which is what I expected. I have read about people pushing serial data directly from the Arduino, but it seems that a full 512 DMX universe is a bit too much, so for those applications they often use an external transcoder like you are.

I also agree that this stuff has gotten incredibly cheap. The cost savings has even filtered down to the Industrial Controls level. I recently worked on a pilot project at work that required a simple PLC to grab some analog level data (standard 4-20 mA) and convert it to digital so it could be read by an app running on a PC. We found a full-fledged PLC for less than $300 that worked flawlessly. (Click-PLC from Automationdirect.com) To get the same thing from Allen-Bradley would have been several thousand bucks at least. Crazy!

Adam

Hi Adam,

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Originally Posted by buffo

If laser sintering 3D printers ever become more affordable, I can see that replacing traditional milling for all sorts of pieces parts.

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I'm actually trying to find interested people (and/or companies) for reactivating one of my older projects with DIY-SLS with different powder materials from plastic, lignin, glass, ceramic, metal ... and all sorts of "alloys".

When I was first trying, it was around 1995 and my "metal powder" was solder-microsheres from washed solder-paste, molten/sintered with a RF-CO2-laser with 3 Watts and first tests with a 1Watt IR-laserdiode (1.5kW then).

Actually you can by laser-engravers with blue laserdiodes and powers of up to 120 Watts ... and I have IR-laserdiodes with up to 360W on a spot of 0.2mm ... or fiberlasers with a 0.02mm-spot.
But let's start with a Sculpfun S30 Pro with 10W on a spot of 0.08mm for 300€ and a self-made "powder-bed" system :cool:

I have to admit, I like the idea of a DIY laser sintering 3D printer! I've seen a few posts from people who have tried (there was a young guy in Germany who had a design that could be built for around 400 euros, for example), but the finish quality of the final part was pretty terrible...

Also, the movable powder bed seems like it would be tricky...

How far did you get with your original design?

Adam

... my "original design" was for the company and under heavy NDA's, so no images ... the next attempts at home were only for testing powders and different concepts - here I simply glued some Tesa-stripes around the borders of a tile (the common Tesa-stripes are 40µm thick, Capton-tape 50µm), poured some powder inbetween and leveled it with a ruler to the stripes height ... then made the laser-sintering.

For bigger powder-particles than the stripes-height, or for "stacking" several layers, I've repeated this (glueing, infilling, levering, laser ...) several times.


*** EDIT *** -- if with the "young guy from Germany" you're referencing to Paul B. - I have his mechanical setup, made from wood and acrylic :cool:

Beside this "two bins" type of powder-bed setup, I have a much simpler type with a rotating disc on a Z-axis, what's completely eliminating the needed pause for refilling and leveling ... and so around 90% of the waiting time, until the next layer is ready to laser ...

Viktor

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Originally Posted by VDX

if with the "young guy from Germany" you're referencing to Paul B. - I have his mechanical setup, made from wood and acrylic :cool:

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Hmmm - could be. I'm not sure of his real name, but the guy I was referring to goes by "Vulcaman" on instructables.com. Here's the link to his second iteration of DIY 3D Laser Sintering printer: https://www.instructables.com/JRLS-1...LS-3D-PRINTER/ Is that the same guy?

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I have a much simpler type with a rotating disc on a Z-axis, what's completely eliminating the needed pause for refilling and leveling

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How does that eliminate the need for leveling? I thought you always had to have a pusher to smooth the powder bed out after you lowered the part? Does the stage rotate fast enough to "spill" fresh powder on top of the printed portion? I'm curious how that would work...

Adam

... no, it's not my friend - the design of "Vulcaman" is near to the Sintratec kit ... could even be a prototype for them.

My "circular" design is pretty simplicistic, where the powder is "automatically" leveled by rotating the disc, without any moving parts ... the combination of "circular leveling" and layerwise moving in Z does the magic ... this has some other nice features, compared to common types, but this is mean for the "closed development" in the group :cool:

Viktor

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Originally Posted by buffo

"I think the problem may have been that there was a Stonehenge monument on stage that was in danger of being crushed by a dwarf!" :D:D:D

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Still such a great movie!

I am right there with you about laser sintering. DMLS has always intrigued me. I'm curious the price per print with metal powder and also with inert gas. 3D printing can be fun though. I know you'll enjoy it. As for designing, I'm not that great at it but I get the job done! I design through Sketchup primarily. At least, that's my go-to software. There is other, better modeling software out there but I fire up Sketchup the most because it's what I know.

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Originally Posted by mixedgas

CNC, you lucky bastard. Manual mill here.... ;)

No ultra sharp corners on LCD cutouts for me... :mad:

NICE!!!!

Steve

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Same here. Everything I do ends up looking like an Etch a Sketch drawing.

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Originally Posted by JohnYayas

Same here. Everything I do ends up looking like an Etch a Sketch drawing.

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Why do you think I went the CNC route??? lol. My manual work looks like it belongs on my mom's fridge with a gold star for trying!

My Day job stuff, having gone from if I need it: A. Full DIY manual shop access, B. Have a Machinist make it to my drawings, or C. send it over to an 8 station CNC shop, to having just a Sears Belt Sander, Hand Drill, Micro drill Press, and Tabletop Drill Press at the new job. The production tooling is sent out to a job shop down the street, thank God.

At my new employer, I do stuff that makes them think I'm Obi Wan Ryobi*, and world class. While I look at my stuff done here at work with more primitive tooling and think I'm Augie Ben Doggie at best. Often, I just take parts home and do them there.

* Well, compared to the last guy at my present employer, I do make good looking stuff. I have to redo / fix thirty years of quickly made gear with no drawings on a daily basis.

Steve

... I'm making "serious stuff" R&D since maybe 30+ years ... since then most "critical" stuff is made at home, as I have all sorts of "DIY" machines from CNC-milling, laser-engraving, paste-dispensing, micro-assembly, (stereo) microscopy ... and even some "nanotech"-stuff ... at home - But only because I was mainly busy with microtech, laser-development and some AI-programming around high-speed position detecting/tracing, image-recognition and microscopy recently -- so no "big, heavy and sturdy" tooling needed :cool:

Pretty all CEO's were OK with this arrangement, as otherwise it would cost some heavy bucks to install this in/for the different day-job in the respective companies >:)

Just watched this, was reminded of this thread, figured VDX & Steve might find it interesting, and decided to share
😎
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsGHr7dXLuI

... yes, a pretty interesting application, if you have the equipment ... luckily I have a 30W MOPA from JPT :cool:

Maybe even more interesting -- my actual setup has a scanner+optic with 110x110mm scan area and a spot diameter of around 35µm ... actually ordered a different telecentric optic, which will give a reduced scan-field of 6x6mm(!) with a resulting spot diameter of only 6µ(!!) ... and roughly 30x higher energy density too (!!!) -- so comparable to a fiberlaser with 30W x 30 ==> 900 Watts (!!!!) >:)

Viktor

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Originally Posted by VDX

... yes, a pretty interesting application, if you have the equipment ... luckily I have a 30W MOPA from JPT :cool:

Maybe even more interesting -- my actual setup has a scanner+optic with 110x110mm scan area and a spot diameter of around 35µm ... actually ordered a different telecentric optic, which will give a reduced scan-field of 6x6mm(!) with a resulting spot diameter of only 6µ(!!) ... and roughly 30x higher energy density too (!!!) -- so comparable to a fiberlaser with 30W x 30 ==> 900 Watts (!!!!) >:)

Viktor

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Very cool. I ended up with a 200W JPT MOPA but I haven't been able to crack the stainless steel coloring yet. I managed to get a mauve color and a very light blue but that's about it. I suspect that it's because I have no idea what grade the stainless is. I imagine that has a lot to do with it. It would seem that there are a lot of variables is getting color right! I'm still learning and having fun with it.

... I've tested some years ago, with an older 30W MOPA and "normal" stainless steel (in German "V2A" or "V4A") with not so good results (first combined image attached).

Most of this "colourfull" results are made with steel, alloyed with Titanium (Chinese something like "steel #92") - have some too, were giveaways on fairs from chinese laser-manufacturers or German companies, importing lasers (mostly from IPG and JPT, second image with the "colour-tree").

Viktor

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Originally Posted by VDX

... I've tested some years ago, with an older 30W MOPA and "normal" stainless steel (in German "V2A" or "V4A") with not so good results (first combined image attached).

Most of this "colourfull" results are made with steel, alloyed with Titanium (Chinese something like "steel #92") - have some too, were giveaways on fairs from chinese laser-manufacturers or German companies, importing lasers (mostly from IPG and JPT, second image with the "colour-tree").

Viktor

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That color tree is great! Thank you for sharing. Once Halloween is done this year and when it cools off in my garage, I am going to play with it a lot more!