help replacing mirrors on new Lserwork 50 K scanners

I have looked but can’t find any one offering advice on the best way to replace mirrors on existing scanners.

I have just recently purchased a set of 50 k scanners from Laserworld, and find that the fine print requires that the factory installed mirrors be replaced with 2 the two supplied mirrors (no instructions) to achieve the higher scanning rates.

As these are replacing some crap Chinese scanners I’m keen to fit the mirrors in the best way possible. I'm interested in

1 - How to remove existing mirrors
2 - What fixing agent to best to use
3 - How best to ensure mirror is 100 balanced / aligned?

I’ve decided my next set will be closed loop Cambridge units.. .as always you get what you pay for i should have just bitten the bullet earlier.

Ive decided my next set will be closed loop cambridge units .. .as always you get what you pay for i should have just bitten the bullet earlier.

any suggeting or sources of information on this would be greatly appreciated

cheers

zero-

"fine print requires that the factory installed mirrors be replaced with 2 the two supplied mirrors (no instructions) to achieve the higher scanning rates."

-is it neccesary to do this? in other words, if it aint broke, dont fix it! :)what are the speeds and angles with the EXISTING mirrors? are you doing professional shows? are you doing more beam work than artwork (graphics). if you are just doing basic laser effects i.e.- beam shows, with little graphics or not-so-intricate graphics, than i would suggest you keep the stock mirrors on. you may be surprised with the effects and the scanning capabilities from the stock mirrors.

"1 - How to remove existing mirrors"

Depends on how they are attached. usually, its just using a soldering iron to heat the adhesive up that holds the mirror in place. then slide the mirror out with a tweezer or needlenose pliers. you should only have to TOUCH the glue for a split second. you DO NOT want to hold the iron on the area for an extended amount of time. you can damage the bearings or scanner if the heat is applied to long.

"2 - What fixing agent to best to use"

epoxy. and just a DROP of it! LITERALLY. these mirrors have VERY VERY little mass. so the amount of adhesive needed to hold them in place is VEEEEEERY little. DO NOT USE CRAZY GLUE OR ANY TYPE OF GLUE WITH "CYANOCRYALATE." (I prob spelled that wrong, sorry). it produces funes that can harm the scanner. and/or mirrors.

"3 - How best to ensure mirror is 100 balanced / aligned?"

you will have to re-tune after applying new mirrors.

-Marc

The unit is used in a small club using fiesta as a controller, we do beam shows but there are lot of pre built effects cones multiple sheets rolling , waves etc. and there is the ability to type text. (The more letters the shitter the result) over 5 letters and its a joke.

I had some image sequences ( the striptease dancing girl was popular for some reason broke this up into (700-800 frame chunks)


The idea of the 50 k scanners it to hopefully be able to get nice crisp results. I have a feeling that we were driving the Chinese scanners to hard (they repeatedly stated they were 30 k scanners)

1 - Ill look how they are attached tonight and update here

2 - will look for epoxy at the hardware store

3 - Was thinking more along the lines of making sure the mirror was a %100 bang on perpendicular IE not leaning fractional forward or back which i would imagine put it out of balance.

Thanks for the advise, i am dreading tunning the unit myself for the 1st time. I’m sure its not so hard, I just don’t want spend more money buying more replacements because I’m a newb at the process

I really wonder if you will get 50k out of the scanners with new mirrors.. I will be interested to see how you go..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dave

I really wonder if you will get 50k out of the scanners with new mirrors.

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Based on what others have posted about Laserworld scanners, I doubt it... :rolleyes:

Adam

zero-

chances are you will not get 50k out of those scanners. :rolleyes: sorry man. unfortunately, the laserworld scanners havent been doing too hot as of late. (from what i have heard and seen here. i DO NOT personally own a pair.)

also, what a lot of companies do is state exagerated speeds of scanning. do you know what angles these scanners *supposedly* get 50k at?

shit, i can buy 12k scanners, bump them down to a scan angle of 2 degrees or something and get 50k out of them probably. what you should look for is a detailed spec like what LASERSHOW PARTS does. 15 degree scan angle, 50k scanning of the ILDA test pattern. THAT is a true 50k scanner. :D

NOW-

dont get discouraged. i am sure that if you give these a GOOD tuning, you can get some pretty decent results out of them. basic geometric patterns DO NOT push scanners too hard. lines, circles, cones, liquid skies, fans, abstract images are all pretty scanner friendly.

when you get into text, animations, graphics, intricate drawing patterns, THIS IS where scanners really get a work out. when scanning laser projections like these, keep your scan angle small!!!! DO NOT overdrive your angles.

read adam's (buffo here on the forum.) scanner tutorial

thats pretty much PL's bible! :D

-Marc

Unfortunately I did not get a chance to inspect the scanners this weekend, A bunch of other stuff came up (including Football Grand finals in Australia) so i didnt get a chance to go over the doco.

I'm pretty sure it stated 50k PPS at 7 Degrees ( with smaller mirrors) or 60 degrees max with existing mirrors and an unspecified speed. I will try to Source their manual online and post it may prove useful in ascertaining if they are in fact capable.

Maybe I should aim for somewhere in the middle is 30K fast enough for average text and logo type work or is 45K a speed that should be targeted

In the past we have been scanning across the room (6 M) and we were covering roughly 3 M on the wall approx 30 Degree scan angle). It is intended to relocate the unit so we shoot the length of the venue which should give us approximately 18 M to the end of the room with the dance floor being around 12-15 mark.

This time i will read more before attempting the process.

My first hard lesson and subsequent set of fried scanners was loading the ILDA test pattern full size at the 30 K straight off the bat. This resulted in a high pitched squeal for 2.5 seconds and a puff of smoke. I now know to start small and slow and work my way up Ill read the scanner tutorial above and see how we go.

to replace those mirrors is just not a case of " a drop of glue and hope for the best"

when the mirrors are assembled onto the shaft in the factory they use a precision jig that makes sure that the mirror is perfectly central and ballanced, the mirror also has to be perfectly in line with the shaft, anything less than perfect will result in instability and you could end up with worse performance than you have with the current mirrors,

the fact that this design is based on the 6800s from cambridge means that making them run at 50k will be pushing them way beyond there design limits ....

i would sugest you tune them to work perfectly at 30k and enjoy the results

My laserworld 50ks run great at 30k .... and they dont run hot or struggle at that.... i think that will also allow me to get the maximum lifetime out of them


all the best ... Karl

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Banthai

to replace those mirrors is just not a case of " a drop of glue and hope for the best"

when the mirrors are assembled onto the shaft in the factory they use a precision jig that makes sure that the mirror is perfectly central and ballanced, the mirror also has to be perfectly in line with the shaft, anything less than perfect will result in instability and you could end up with worse performance than you have with the current mirrors,

the fact that this design is based on the 6800s from cambridge means that making them run at 50k will be pushing them way beyond there design limits ....

i would sugest you tune them to work perfectly at 30k and enjoy the results

My laserworld 50ks run great at 30k .... and they dont run hot or struggle at that.... i think that will also allow me to get the maximum lifetime out of them


all the best ... Karl

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Karl,

Thanks for the response, it good to know my knock off are at least being copied from what seems to be the best in the industry, as I stated in my 1st post i think next time i will just avoid the pain and pay the price for the real thing.

I was hesitant to do the mirror swap as I didn’t feel it would be a straight forward procedure (thus this post).

Can you advise what scan angle you are achieving when running at 30K ?

Do you find 30 K cuts if for graphics and text or am i just hoping for more than can be expected for the outlay?

Hi Zero

when i tested them, i ran the Ilda test pattern at 8 degs

this is the reccomended for running the test patteren

see here .... http://www.pangolin.com/ILDAtest.html

most of the time im doing beamshows .... so ive never really had to worry to much about speed etc

also rob ( stanwax ) produced a chart that you can use to set the scan angle .... just place it 30cm infront of your projector, display the ilda test pattern and adjust the size to it fits the chart , he posted it here somewere on PL

all the best ... Karl


Ps .... can you fill in your profile so we know your location

leaving mirrors in place ....

Installing the the laserworld scanners now and have come across a big sticking point.

My ilda card only seems to have 3 cables XY and ground lead , this use to go to a driver single card that that drove both scanners.

i am not sure how to feed these 3 leads (X,Y,Ground) into the laser world scanner driver board which has 2 seperate driver boards (x & y Board) requiring ILDA +5,-5 Ground + other stuff from the 24 V PSU.

Should i leave skip this cabeling and take signal direct frem where the ilda cable enters the unit (effectivley pulling signal directly from the Fiesta DAC)

was hoping to get this up tonight but see i will have wait till tomorrow

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Banthai

to replace those mirrors is just not a case of " a drop of glue and hope for the best"

when the mirrors are assembled onto the shaft in the factory they use a precision jig that makes sure that the mirror is perfectly central and ballanced, the mirror also has to be perfectly in line with the shaft, anything less than perfect will result in instability and you could end up with worse performance than you have with the current mirrors

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Sucks for me as I managed to knock one of my mirrors off. I did manage to get it back in nicely, only to later learn that I put it in the wrong way around... Doh!

Now I'm a bit reluctant to remove the mirror and put it back in the right way.

My trick to get it parallel with the shaft is to let the mirror hang straight down from the scanner while the epoxy is curing, that way gravity will pull it straight. Unfortunately that's not all there is to it. You also need the mirror to be perfectly centered.

hi zero

see my PM buddy


Karl