Senior Member
both pat AND george are stand up guys. i have dealt with both before. this seems VERY out of character for both.
hope it gets worked out professionally. I dont think this is a circumstance with "wrong" parties involved. i think its more of mis communication.
just my happy horseshit 2 cents opinion
-Marc
ILDA- U.S. Laser Regulatory Committee
Authorized Dealer for:
- Pangolin Laser Software and Hardware
- KVANT Laser Modules & Laser Systems
- X-Laser USA
- CNI Lasers
- Cambridge Technology & Eye Magic Professional Scanning Systems
FDA/CDRH Certified Professional LuminanceRGB Laser Light Show Systems
Senior Member
alright, well let me rephrase myself. pat, please give me a call so we can talk about this like adults. I didn't mean to sound demanding but even if I did I don't think the appropriate response would be "you dont know me very well do you". Its not like I said, send it overnight or elseOriginally Posted by gottaluvlasers
Senior Member
You may have already reported me for "paypal violations" (which would be a HUGE mistake on your part) so I have nothing to say to you . EXCEPT...
You threatened to report me to paypal for "violating their policies" not because a completed transaction went bad and needed resolution and you required their protection...only because you didnt get exactly what you wanted, exactly when you wanted it, for exactly the terms you wanted and so you acted like a little bitch and was going to report me for violating "their terms". IT HAD ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH PAYPAL YET YOU WANTED TO PUNISH ME...What are you...the PayPal FUCKING Police??? That is a little bitch move.
The ONLY time I deal with little bitches is to slap them. Report me...and the PLANET will know you are a little tattle tale bitch. You insulted me and implied that I was gouging you on shipping charges, it was offensive and I have nothing more to say to you.
I was doing you a god damned favor by selling you flexmods that are not on my site, taking them from my personal inventory to help you out, so I made a fair deal and to drop everything and handle you for $20.00 shipping...AND YOU BITCH???
PFFFFUCKINGTTTTTTT
let the jury decide who screwed the pooch.
Pat B
laserman532 on ebay
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt & selling it in a garage sale.
Senior Member
whatever, i stepped forward and tried to work it out. I love how you go so far off topic, use countless obscenities and refer to me as a bitch, it only helps show your insecurities, lack of self control, and immaturity.
I think a lot of people are keeping their mouth shut because they need something you have (happens around here a lot and you know it). No one has said that you did no wrong here. The jury is only hung because you provide an item that is going to be needed in great quantity as of 2 days ago. If you are too blind to see that then you are living in a dream world.
I knew I acted like a fool after the fact and obviously was prepared to admit all when I posted it online. I dont even have to ask people who acted more foolishly though, I can without a doubt say it was you.
I like how you still continue to threaten me. Saying it would be a huge mistake on my part, seriously you a child in an adults body. No I am not the paypal police but I do find it unfair that I follow the rules of paypal to a T and you dont. I notice a lot of other members do not as well but I always have, you could always pay me and I wouldnt charge 3% upcharge to cover fees or ask that people pay me as a gift instead of goods. So I find it wrong that you are not following the rules.
Pat you need to grow up, I mean your what would be considered an elder in the laser industry and you act just like many of them who are not on PL or alt.lasers
Make an open threat to me one more time and I will file a police report because quite honestly I dont know what you are capable of. You lost control of your emotions rather quickly over me making a "demand" as you called it, sure it might not have had the tone you liked but small businesses deal with that every day, not just large corporations. The point is how insane you became, you lost control of reality.
I still dont know why in the world you kept bringing up customs charges. Your upcharge for handling has nothing to do with customs charges.
I tell you what, I bet your happy the 445nm's just unleashed a race, you can finally sell off all of the flexmods that you bought hoping your beam combining kits would sell and they obviously didnt "clear the shelves"
By the way, I have not reported you but there are plenty of people who love to report violations like that who live on this forum. I am sure someone has seen your constant rambling and admissions from you and decided to go ahead and pull the trigger. You dug your own grave as soon as you threatened me.
GROW UP PAT
Senior Member
dude, seriously, put the pipe down because you are fucking high.
It has been you threaten me the whole time. When I said you need to rethink your actions or I will post the PM's that it would surely show how you tried to manipulate me and threaten me with the paypal thing because YOU didnt get EXACTLY WHAT YOU WANTED. So now you are going to go tell paypal what a bad boy I am...Who is childish and immature???
Now you are threatening to call the police on me...for what calling you a bitch. a fucktard, a asshat...what??? You threatened me, but because I have a penis and some very large, very full balls...im not going to go whine to paypal, police, or the unitarian church...because I fight my own battles...daddy taught me that way...
People are hung because they hate drama....which you brought...so you do look like a ass hat...my whole reason to want to post the pms in the first place, to show the forum that you were willing to SHIT all over someone because you didnt get your way. It proves you were clearly a ass hat.
Nobody is breaking down my doors to buy stuff, I doubt they will, it is still a very small market which makes very little income for me, its a freakin hobby. People want to do their own thing, if I can sell a part great, if not oh well it is really no biggie to me. I develop shit, because I like to...it is certainly not to get rich on PL..so wake up and smell the coffee.
Not tattle telling on me to paypal was the smartest thing you have done all day, because you would be clearly viewed on PL as a little tattle tale telling bitch. Nobody likes a little tattle tale telling bitch, so you saved yourself some embarrassment. Its all there for everyone to see.
You may not know this but people (not me of course) ship things overseas and value customs invoice slightly lower to avoid the customer the added VAT (and customers appreciate that). Similarly some people (certainly not me) keep their prices low by avoiding exorbitant fees the best way they know how (and customers appreciate that).
But it is clever how you now say you wont report me but someone else here will, you have proven you are untrustworthy when you dont get your way so, I expect anything....
UPCHARGE on shipping??? Did I say kiss my ass yet???
Im bored with you now, go make your laser toys with all those un- upcharged parts you have coming to you tomorrow. You will get NADA, ZIP NOTHING from me. IF you give me a couple of days I will make you a medal for you to proudly wear around your neck, something like..."Worlds Most Honest PayPal Patron" or something along those lines...will that work for you???
You can tell me to grow up...I can say KISS MY ASS GEORGE
Pat B
laserman532 on ebay
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt & selling it in a garage sale.
This is a case of two people with strong personalities succumbing to the limits of a narrow-bandwith communications channel. Nothing more.
I know George well. And I've spoken with Pat on the phone a few times (most recently on Wednesday of this week), and conversed with him via PM multiple times. In my option, both are professional people.
George, I believe if you had called Pat on the phone to place your order, things would have gone just fine. But due to a series of misunderstandings, the whole thing has been blown way out of proportion. Perhaps in the future, the two of you ought to consider doing business on the phone, where intentions are easier to determine.
Pat, I agree that George's initial reply, where he said that he needed overnight shipping, sounded a bit demanding. However, I also know George personally, so I understand that he didn't mean it that way. He's a busy guy (like many of us), and his messages are often very short and to the point. The problem is that it's easy to confuse brevity with aggression.
And Pat, you are also a very nice guy. At the end of your first message you said "we'll work something out". So obviously you were willing to get George the parts he needed in a hurry and just didn't have exact shipping costs at your fingertips. Still, I believe when you read George's initial reply (asking for overnight shipping), you felt insulted at the shortness of the message. Which explains your angry tone in the second message. Unfortunately, George responded to that tone, and that's when the urinary olympics began.
The problem is, I'm sure neither one of you wanted it to come to this. You were both feeding off each other's anger and responding to the perceived slights directed at you from the previous message. The crux of the issue (the need for overnight shipping, and the cost of said shipping) was lost in the ensuing flame war.
And what a flame war it has become. At this point, neither one of you has a leg left to stand on. You've both been very unprofessional, and that bothers me greatly because I know that both of you are better than this.
Pat, George is right. It's against the Paypal terms of service to ask a buyer to pay as a gift. I didn't know this, but I looked it up. (In fairness, I may have caused this problem, since I volunteered to do it on my order, because I didn't want to stick you with the Paypal fees. I didn't know this was prohibited - my bad.) Also, it's rather hypocritical to tell someone they're being childish when you yourself are dropping F-bombs all over the place. I think a little restraint on your part at the beginning could have gone a long way towards preventing this.
And George, while it may have been your prerogative to report him to Paypal, you have to admit that he probably didn't know he was violating the TOS. You could have simply informed him of this and left it at that. By reporting him (or even threatening to), you are being vindictive, and that hardly seems appropriate. By going on the offensive, you weren't working towards a solution at all. Just pouring fuel on the fire.
In all honestly, George, you could have written your request for overnight shipping a lot better. It *does* sound snarky. And you know that absent any other reference, the worst interpretation is probably the one people are going to assume.
But Pat, you've been around long enough to understand this too. Instead of adding in the part about "busting my chops" and "I'll reserve what I'm really thinking", you could have simply clarified your terms and left it at that. Maybe he would have bought from you - maybe not. But the flame war would have ended before it ever started.
The agonizing thing about all of this is that if the two of you were sitting at a bar over a couple drinks, you'd be having the time of your lives telling stories and laughing it up. But because you don't know each other in person, you each assumed the very worst about the other, and the result is all this vitriol above. And that sucks, guys...
You are both better men than this. Please, PLEASE, can we have a "do over" on this whole thing? Because the stuff above isn't helping anyone.
Let's re-set the clock (and the scoreboard) and start again. And if you still don't want to do business with each other, can we at least return to a civil level of discussion for all other matters?
Adam
I spent an hour trying to think of something similar to say...
...............
Love, peace, and grease,
allthat... aka: aaron@pangolin
Senior Member
Too late, he needed it overnight...Let's re-set the clock (and the scoreboard) and start again.
At this point, I often find pistols at dawn is the only fair way to settle these things.
Perhaps with a twist - large frame ion at 40 paces?
Senior Member
from my perspective...In my mind I envisioned a 260 lb woman with a very large ass, with her hair up in curlers, riding a three wheeled bike, with a big wire basket with a poodle in the back, with a big orange flag on a fiberglass pole, going around the neighborhood with her ruler measuring the grass for the home owners association...and if someone dosnt get a water hose and shoot that bitch off the bike we are all doomed to become that person...Next to liars...I absolutely despise people like that and I'm going for the water hose...fuck it!
Nobody is perfect, even that skank on the trike, but when you say you follow some corporations TOS to the T when they would clearly without conscience gouge you into a long dirt nap and you feel it is your duty to report people that do violate their TOS you are nothing but a bitch and a snitch...the lowest of the low and when it gets around that you are a snitch...you better watch your back because some people don't appreciate it. That is not a threat...its a fact of life. It is people like that who destroy personal freedoms and liberty for others just so they can feel good about themselves and through intimidation...MAKE YOU CONFORM.
I gave george a fair quote with no confusion, and he complained and whined...he could have said "well no thank you" and rode off on his trike and left me alone.
Last edited by Laserman532; 06-04-2010 at 14:01.
Pat B
laserman532 on ebay
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt & selling it in a garage sale.
Needs moar photons
man this is almost as heated as a laser ben thread
come on guys, step back from the keyboard for a second, chill out, life is short
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