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Thread: SpiroDAC

  1. #21
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    Dean, I suggest to not even think about the GUI at this stage. Create a nice little engine that exposes properties for setting oscillator values and has a way to retrieve points based on time. You can create a higher level class that retrieves data in real time and buffers it. Maybe have some sort of callback that can be used to pump the data into a video window, ILDA file, DAC, etc. You can write all of the important part of your application without even thinking about a GUI. Then, a person can grab your code and put their own GUI on top of it without too much trouble.

  2. #22
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    I suggest to not even think about the GUI at this stage.
    Are you saying that I should go back to a DOS prompt for the short term (how I hope not; if James is reading this he will burn up the phone line to tell me I TOLD YOU SO!)?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dchammonds View Post
    Are you saying that I should go back to a DOS prompt for the short term (how I hope not; if James is reading this he will burn up the phone line to tell me I TOLD YOU SO!)?
    No, I didn't mean that at all. I meant that the core of your application is a GUI-less coordinate generator. You can start by just creating that in C++ as a black box. Then you can easily add a GUI to it after you are more familiar with C++. Or you could give the black box to heroic and tell her to make her own Mac GUI with whatever she wants. You can also generically expose the output so anyone can pipe it to a DirectX window, an ILDA file, a TCP/IP port to some client at your friends house where he watches your laser images on his projector while you twiddle the knobs. The possibilities are endless. But, if you embed everything together in some monolithic GUI app you are limited by what can be done with it. You can create SpiroDAC with a few sliders, or you can create Super Awesome Spiro Engine that becomes your legacy as it becomes the foundation of many different variations of abstract generators. OK, maybe I am getting carried away there but you get the point.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnYayas View Post
    No, I didn't mean that at all. I meant that the core of your application is a GUI-less coordinate generator.
    ...what he said.

    If you write it in nice clean C, I can put it on a microcontroller with DMX, USB and MIDI interfaces and hey presto that's a product you can sell :-)

    -J.

  5. #25
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    When it comes to making decent abstracts, it comes down to 3 things:

    0.1% Inspiration

    49.9% Trial and error

    50% Dumb luck, to include typos that wind up looking cool by pure accident. The only trick is to harness those accidents in a useful way.

    The goal for me is to master a common language to express the above.

    Dean

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by dchammonds View Post
    When it comes to making decent abstracts, it comes down to 3 things:
    0.1% Inspiration
    49.9% Trial and error
    50% Dumb luck, to include typos that wind up looking cool by pure accident. The only trick is to harness those accidents in a useful way.
    The goal for me is to master a common language to express the above.
    Dean
    I think I'll both agree and disagree on this at the same time (sure, that is possible, right?) You are definitely on to something here, but I think that perhaps like anything else, from person to person, or even with more experience, training, and the right tools, these numbers work out to be different percentages.

    I've found myself to be quite inspired to patch abstracts over the years. I have found it to be a great art and challenge. In fact, at this point it is far more inspiration that drives my abstract patching than anything else. I find myself wanting to recreate classic images that I've seen in old shows, or create new things that I wouldn't have thought could be patched. The songs that I work on that I really want to do end up being the ones that I blow through very quickly, rather than drudge through them wanting it to just be over.

    The tools certainly play a big part in setting the boundaries for what is possible. I really lucked out in getting wind of DigiSynth when I did, as it was exactly what I was looking for to make the abstracts I needed. I was honestly shocked that anyone would put that much effort in to a tool for an industry that had all but abandoned the real art of abstract imagery. It is great to see that others have that interest too!

    My intention here certainly isn't to turn this into a DS infomercial. I can't speak to the function or usability of the OP's software, but I would like to say a few things about abstracts.

    There is a process to create specific classes of abstracts, a method that is easily repeatable to get you to a general class or to a specific image. The use of oscillators, amplifiers, rotators, multipliers, sequencers and other image synthesizer components is a skill that can be learned and understood just like following any other signal path. This is why I think patching of abstracts is something that can be understood by a large number of people in the industry, especially at the hobbiest level, where one tends to have to wire up many of the tools of the trade themselves, so the basic patch comprehension skills are inherent.

    There are patch theories that are road maps to creating great images and allowing for great performances. Some of these are quite simple, like the idea of using common frequencies on base oscillators so that one can find the harmonic for a colormod easily when the entire show is performed. Understanding the relations of harmonics and how one performs an image to evoke an emotional response in the audience is something that has gotten a bit lost out there. There is psychology and science involved, and playing to the way we react to our perceptions is a large part of creating a show for not just the eyes, but ultimately the mind.

    I guess trial and error is the thing you do when you don't have that roadmap to follow. Although between that and the dumb luck, I will say that with abstract patching it is very possible and not uncommon to try things out of curiosity or to accidentally connect something and come up with an amazing image. With point-based imagery it really takes an effort to make an image that looks cool and really works. This is something that I have struggled with over the years. I'm not an animator or illustrator. I am much better with geometry and abstract imagery, and I can weave in elements from animators.

    I was fortunate enough to have my skills forged in the fires of production at AVI, where abstracts were a huge part of the process, but certainly not the only flavor of image at our disposal. It was a little scary at first looking at the massive patchbay with little cryptic names for all the RCA jacks, but I am very glad that I had that opportunity. It is still one of the coolest skill sets to be productive with.

    Abstracts, or even lasershows as a whole are all about the performance, the artful techniques, and development. Not just putting an image up there to fill 23.6 seconds, but to lead the audience through an experience, be their tour guide for the show and help them to first understand what a lasershow is. Then ease them into the understanding of how it works before you eventually blow their minds by breaking through the barriers that they thought they understood.

    Laser abstracts really are a beautiful art form. As an industry we have barely scratched the surface of what is possible.

    -chuck

  7. #27
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    any more development on this going on???

    it would be really neat if you could make this work with a control surface like the novation remote zero SL...

    and if you could save "presets" that you could recall quickly and start tweaking from there...

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by flecom View Post
    any more development on this going on???

    it would be really neat if you could make this work with a control surface like the novation remote zero SL...

    and if you could save "presets" that you could recall quickly and start tweaking from there...
    Thanks for your interest in my app!

    I'm sitting on a newer version that allows for switching between EZL and sound DAC modes from within the app, but I want to add a couple more XYZ op modes before releasing.

    I code in VB6 and am attempting to learn C# and VB.net lately, so that has taken up some of my time, but it could open doors to better apps down the road.

    Dean

  9. #29
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    Default New Version

    SpiroDAC now has support for the RIYA (thanks to much help from drlava!), as well
    as EZLase and modified soundcards. You now can switch from any of these within the app.
    Also added are some additional XYZ Op Modes (and probably a few bugs)...

    http://laserboy.org/lwave/

    Dean

  10. #30
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    Thanks Dean I'm going to give it a try tonight.

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