Mega RGB via KTP / Dye / 445... Discuss...

[heroic]

However, I doubt there is a lot of research into multiline lasers at this time, .

On the contrary, light sources for TV and video projectors are where the money's at these days.

[goninanbl00d]

AFAIK there is no way you can make a multi-line dye laser system, right? If there was, I could envision a solid state pumped 'broadband multiline' dye laser which could be a good replacement for all those 4' glass tubes once used for display purposes, if you can see where I'm going

IMO, an Ar-Kr whitelight is still a better bet for full colour lasers than combining a bunch of diode beams. A whitelight beam has better parameters and doesn't need colour alignment, furthermore, subtractive colour mixing through a PCAOM gives a lot prettier colours than throwing RGB together.

However, I doubt there is a lot of research into multiline lasers at this time, since it's only really useful to have a 400nm-650nm multiline head for laser displays (show purposes). If there was one, it would give RGB diode projectors a major run for their money. Imagine a perfectly-aligned, TEM00 beam you could shoot through a PCAOM for a full rainbow of colours and still have a projector the size of your home CD player...

Whitelight dye has been done by an experimenter.

It was a blend of three dyes, pumped by a nitrogen laser. Solid state pumping wouldn't work, as the dyes lasing blue and green would need something else rather than 532nm (due to Stokes' Law). By the time you THG (or even FHG)'d a solid state laser down into the UV, most of your efficiency would have been lost already.

Here is the link:

http://www.jossresearch.org/tjiirrs/014.html

[RGbee]

"It’s possible to synthesise excited bromide in an Argon matrix. Yes, it’s an eximer, frozen in it’s excited state.
As soon as we apply a field, we couple to a state that is radiatively coupled to the ground state"

Sorry guys, had to do it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ds0wYpc1eM

Adrian

[mixedgas]

That movie, if you look at the credits,lists a group of Coherent staff engineers who were advising on the project. That is why the "scientists" in the actually seem know about the internals of lab lasers. It is why the lasers have Brewster windows and need clean optics. The props are for the most part, actual laser systems and prototypes.


Mercury Bromide was a big deal at the time,intended for tunable blue green lasers for satellite to sub communications. Hence the "Argon-Bromide". Which if the bromine did not eat cathodes and anodes for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, might really be a pretty good mix for visible light.

Lets face it, a good movie was wrote with input from engineers and technicians. Same can be said for Avatar, the lab scenes all have fume hoods and the yellow cabinets used for storing flammable and reactive materials.

The prof sleeping with the student... Priceless. (If you've ever worked at a university!)
The other student slashing the work of the good guy, (all too true..if you like stereotypes)

Steve

[dsli_jon]

hey S3K...

AFAIK there is no way you can make a multi-line dye laser system, right? If there was, I could envision a solid state pumped 'broadband multiline' dye laser

If there is a way, I am sure this guy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F._J._Duarte will find it... I used to work with him at Eastman Kodak, like ~20 yrs ago (eek...) doing his 'publication drawings', like, 'mech-drawings' of this kind of stuff... but, I learned a ton from him...

...He had this really-amazing custom-built tunable HeNe in his lab, that - I swear - IIRC, he also had it emitting blue... not, of course, *from* the HeNe-mix, but not-sure if, somehow, he had actually-created a 'HeNeCd'... Dunno how that'd even-be possible, but, the guy was über-brilliant, and really 'down to earth' and loved to explain stuff...

IMO, an Ar-Kr whitelight is still a better bet for full colour lasers than combining a bunch of diode beams. A whitelight beam has better parameters and doesn't need colour alignment, furthermore, subtractive colour mixing through a PCAOM gives a lot prettier colours than throwing RGB together.

While I do-agree:




...it is awfully-hard to shoot-down the 'convenience-factor'... ie: THIS and THIS vs THIS...

...So, in the end, I do-believe that the 'maturing' of OPSLs, and, 'dawning' of multi-line fiber-lasers, ie: http://www.mpbc.ca/_en/web/lasers/cw/index.html in the near-same wavelengths as our beloved-ions, and, even-more radical, 'supercontinuum' sources, ie: http://www.fianium.com/supercontinuum.htm will, indeed, ultimately 'forever-bury' ions, at least as far-as light-shows go, somewhere down the road... Still, for certain-specific applications (ie: really-long throw / super-tight divergence-needs, etc...) Ions will rule for a while, yet...

However, I doubt there is a lot of research into multiline lasers at this time,...

As Heroic correctly pointed-out, yeah, there actually is, but - not it's just not focused on *our* industry... as Steve said, 'if it were only-for the needs of the light-show industry,
a lot of the stuff we have access-to, would never have even gotten developed, at-all'... 'we' do, indeed, benefit from all the other 'purposes' of lasers-development, even-though, usually, we are always 'retro-fitting' for our-needs (...umm, ie: the XJ-A130-40s... )

Really, you can build-up an all-solid-state, near-Ion beam-quality, multi-line 'WL', with near-PCAOM modulation-quality, right-now, with all-OPSL... you just need a six-digit budget...

...Oh well, one can dream, right?
cheers...
j

[dsli_jon]

hey G -

What would be the worst case scenario if a different dye was used?

Like Steve pointed-out, it's more of a 'practical-consideration' - the dye-mix in the LS 600, *does* super-stain porcelain (and everything-else it comes in contact-with...clothes, sneakers, gloves, fingertips, etc, etc...it's, uh, 'dye', ya know? ) - it's just not, a simple-job like, 'changing the DI water' in your pump-KTP... ...and, yes, 'environmentally-
conscious-disposal' is also a consideration...

Point I was making, was not in-doing a 'scrub n swap', but, actually trying to mix-in a 'homebrewed formula', guessing at the exact-mix... concern-is, killing the efficiency,
that's there, as 'lower than optimal' as it might-be, with the guesswerk...

..and yes, P'Fessor, thanks for the 'Exciton-call' idea, but again, not sure if they'd even-know what 'sekret quenchers / additives' also might be in there...

...but, really, it's not all that 'important', right now, seeing as-how I *can* get ~10W+ of Red out of it, as-is (and-that, thru lossy-fiber; direct-pump, on-deck, would likely yield better...) and I'm no-where-near having the free-time to build up this 'Mega RGB-koncept'...

...I just think, a. It's potentially-doable, with KTP / Dye / 445, all in the same 'OEM-rig'... I really can't think of a relatively-simpler, 'non ion-based-way', to generate this potentially-much R G and B, for as relatively-cheaply as you could do this...and, b. It'd be a 'fun ride' / challenge, at-least... there's certainly plenty of room on the deck,
on a LS KTP, to do it, especially adding a 'second-deck', for color / blanking and beam-pics...

PS - Lovin all the 'spin-off discussions' from this...
peace...
j

[tocket]

Jon, we have plenty of people around here with IR spectrometers, determining the mix may be easier if you attack it that way. Bribe one of our resident grad students with some nice piece of gear and have them run a KBR pellet doped with the dye mix. The test will only need a few tens of milligrams.

I think it might be hard to determine that with an IR spectrometer. If there are several components the spectrum will be a mess. Personally I would use LC/MS to determine the composition.

If you do run IR I would suggest using about 3 mg per pellet. If you use more you might end up with too high absorbance.

[flecom]

[goninanbl00d]

hey G -



Like Steve pointed-out, it's more of a 'practical-consideration' - the dye-mix in the LS 600, *does* super-stain porcelain (and everything-else it comes in contact-with...clothes, sneakers, gloves, fingertips, etc, etc...it's, uh, 'dye', ya know? ) - it's just not, a simple-job like, 'changing the DI water' in your pump-KTP... ...and, yes, 'environmentally-
conscious-disposal' is also a consideration...

Point I was making, was not in-doing a 'scrub n swap', but, actually trying to mix-in a 'homebrewed formula', guessing at the exact-mix... concern-is, killing the efficiency,
that's there, as 'lower than optimal' as it might-be, with the guesswerk...

..and yes, P'Fessor, thanks for the 'Exciton-call' idea, but again, not sure if they'd even-know what 'sekret quenchers / additives' also might be in there...

...but, really, it's not all that 'important', right now, seeing as-how I *can* get ~10W+ of Red out of it, as-is (and-that, thru lossy-fiber; direct-pump, on-deck, would likely yield better...) and I'm no-where-near having the free-time to build up this 'Mega RGB-koncept'...

...I just think, a. It's potentially-doable, with KTP / Dye / 445, all in the same 'OEM-rig'... I really can't think of a relatively-simpler, 'non ion-based-way', to generate this potentially-much R G and B, for as relatively-cheaply as you could do this...and, b. It'd be a 'fun ride' / challenge, at-least... there's certainly plenty of room on the deck,
on a LS KTP, to do it, especially adding a 'second-deck', for color / blanking and beam-pics...

PS - Lovin all the 'spin-off discussions' from this...
peace...
j

Yeah, making a mess would be the least of your concerns. Dye disposal, cleaning up, and opening up the dye reservoir without making a mess.

Then you'd have to try and work out what the dye used is.

It'd be worth a shot if it were practical, but there *are* better options out there.

Well, that was an interesting spin-off convo. I'm sure quite a few of us feel the same way as flecom

[dsli_jon]

hey there...

Then you'd have to try and work out what the dye used is.

Well, a public *Thanks* to our Dear P'Fessor, mixedgas, who graciously called Exciton to probe the 411 on the LS-mix, (just cause he's such a nice guy.. and I've got some good tips, now, for future-trials, when-ready (...which wouldn't-be till I did the rest of the werk, anyway, and the Red, doing ~10W, as-is, would certainly be 'good enough', for a 'proof of concept' build... )

...we'll see... a 'Mega RGB', as-described, here, is about Item# 47,993.2 on my 'wish-List of Things To Do'... I'll post-pix, when / if-ever...

<exploding head-shot>

Woah, Dude, that's gotta sting! ...want some 'bactine'?

PS - your little box *finally* went-out, today... helluva week last week...
peace...
j