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Thread: Doing a show? Where?

  1. #1
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    Default Doing a show? Where?

    :? Now let's say you have all your laser kit in good working order. And you have a nice business card printed up and you think you are ready to do a few shows now and then. What is a good way to get the word out about what you want to do and maintain some control of the party/venue that you will show up to do your show. What about non-profit , indoor shows? Donations accepted? Does one still need all the paperwork? The local show at the Science Center just gives you a ticket for $10 and you take your seat..... 2 hours of Floyd and other songs with a 6 watt white light. And if you stood up at the wrong time you could get personal with all that power at times.They do usher you in and ask that you remain seated. Maybe I worry too much....but don't like the idea of getting fined for something I can keep the safety levels in control. I have read and understand all of their rules. Just wanting to have some fun........and make a little $
    You are the only one that can make your dreams come true....and the only one that can stop them...A.M. Dietrich

  2. #2
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    Network with event production companies, party hire companies, club promoters, etc
    KVANT Australian projector sales
    https://www.facebook.com/kvantaus/

    Lasershowparts- Laser Parts at great prices
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Doing a show? Where?

    Quote Originally Posted by MechEng3
    What about non-profit , indoor shows? Donations accepted? Does one still need all the paperwork?
    If donations are accepted, or if a nominal admition is charged to cover the setup costs (non-profit), I'm thinking that the CDRH will still rule that "commerce" of some sort is occurring (since money is changing hands), and thus they have jurisdiction and will require a variance for the show. The only real loophole is if the show is totally free, and is also NOT associated with some other larger event that does require admission. (For example, a free show at a church or school is OK, but a free show at a nightclub is not, because patrons are buying drinks, paying the cover charge to get in, etc...)
    The local show at the Science Center just gives you a ticket for $10 and you take your seat..... 2 hours of Floyd and other songs with a 6 watt white light. And if you stood up at the wrong time you could get personal with all that power at times. They do usher you in and ask that you remain seated.
    That show is probably illegal then. Even if they have a variance, they aren't following it if you could stand up in the audence and touch the beams. (3 meters above the floor at the highest point in the audience is the rule.) My guess is that the show is flying below the radar of the CDRH, and that's why they're getting away with what they're doing. But if an inspector saw that, he could (and probably would) shut the show down.

    I've spoken with a few people that have been caught by the CDRH without variances, and in both cases they had *very* safe equipment and were operating the show within the guidelines. Nonetheless, they were forced to shut down the show. (Well, in one case the inspector didn't approach the laserist until after the show was over, so he got to finish the event at least.) Fortunately, no one got fined, but this happened several years ago. Also, I'm sure it all hinges on what sort of person your local CDRH rep. is... If he's a jerk, you could be in trouble.

    Maybe I worry too much....but don't like the idea of getting fined for something I can keep the safety levels in control. I have read and understand all of their rules. Just wanting to have some fun........and make a little $
    If I were you, I'd just give the CDRH a call and talk to them about what you want to do. Then go ahead and file for a variance. Also, ask them to put you in touch with your local inspector. (By local, I mean somewhere in the state; my state only has 1, and he's in Columbia - 90 miles away...)

    The folks I've talked to at the CDRH were *very* helpfull. Like most people in authority, I imagine they'd rather spend their time educating people about the rules vs. enforcing the rules after an infraction has already occurred.

    If you get your show varianced, you'll be in a much better position later on if some nut jub decides to sue you for his macular degeneration by claiming that your laser show did the damage. (Which we all know is BS, but it's up to YOU to prove to the court that your lasers didn't somehow contribute to the problem. A variance would be very helpful in that respect.)

    Just my $.02
    Adam

  4. #4
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    where on the web can I find the law about lasershow ?

    And yes... I want to find the rules for us in Europe (Norway?)

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by liteglow
    where on the web can I find the law about lasershow ?

    And yes... I want to find the rules for us in Europe (Norway?)
    As far as i know we have no rules in sweden. Except for the normal rules that you need a license for Class IV lasers.
    You know, I have one simple request. And that is to have sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads!

  6. #6
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    We in Canada don't suffer from the draconic rules they Impose on laserists in the USA.
    Common sense, safety and laser awareness along with comercial business Insurance should be enough to cover all the bases. My guess is the rules are not as stringent outside the USA and almost non existant in some countries.
    The US FDA & CDRH go way overboard , coupled with the paranoia induced by Homeland Security it's bad for business. If you get your science from Miami CSI ( there was an episode on blinding a pilot and downing an aircraft ), then you're grossly mis-informed (feeding the public fear and ignorance of lasers).
    More has to be done to educate the public or more laser businesses in the US will die.

    Rick
    Profile Redacted by Admin @ 04.24.2010

  7. #7
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    A little OT:
    Quote Originally Posted by liteglow
    I want to find the rules for us in Europe (Norway?)
    Since when belongs Norway to Europe? (no, don't hurt me, stop... ;-))

    "Fälschung"=counterfeit


    The interested reader might notice the missing "Norway" next to Sweden on the 2 Euro coin (Switzerland is actually missing, too).

    Afaik there are no "european rules" regarding laser safety for the time beeing; every country deals with it on it's own. Germany's pretty bad in that regard, but we still can have audience scanning :-)

    Cheers
    Christoph
    Popelscan is still alive - check out here!

  8. #8
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    Norway is a part of the EUROPE union !!
    But NOT a member of EU


    And i`m so glad for that 8)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Doing a show? Where?

    Quote Originally Posted by Buffo
    Quote Originally Posted by MechEng3
    What about non-profit , indoor shows? Donations accepted? Does one still need all the paperwork?
    If donations are accepted, or if a nominal admition is charged to cover the setup costs (non-profit), I'm thinking that the CDRH will still rule that "commerce" of some sort is occurring (since money is changing hands), and thus they have jurisdiction and will require a variance for the show. The only real loophole is if the show is totally free, and is also NOT associated with some other larger event that does require admission. (For example, a free show at a church or school is OK, but a free show at a nightclub is not, because patrons are buying drinks, paying the cover charge to get in, etc...)
    What about free outdoor shows?

  10. #10
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    Eric;

    The problem with outdoor shows is that:

    1) you might draw more attention to yourself and your show, and thus some busybody might call the CDRH on you. This can be dealt with rather easily so long as the show is being held on private property (not creating a public hazard) and there is no commerce of any sort going on. However, being that the show is outside, this leads you to...

    2) you may draw the ire of the FAA if you have un-terminated beams going up in the air. Note that the FAA couldn't care less about whether you have a CDRH variance for your show or not. They want to be sure you've filled out the proper paperwork that THEY require. This is non-trivial documentation we're talking about!

    If you can arrange your show such that the beams aren't going up into the sky, and can't leave the area, then you should be OK. But send a beam into the sky without getting FAA approval, and you'll be in some serious hot water. (And I mean serious...)

    What did you have in mind anyway? A show in your backyard for halloween? Or maybe a gathering for friends at someone's farm? Both of those should be OK so long as you keep the beams out of the sky.

    You might also want to consider calling the CDRH and telling them what you plan to do. They were pretty helpful when I called them, and that was just 2 years ago, so I doubt they've gone all sour on us in the mean time...

    Adam

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