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Thread: Any tips for knife-edging dual 445's...?

  1. #11
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    swamidog is online now Jr. Woodchuckington Janitor III, Esq.
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    cd, yes. i'm using two sets prism pairs. one diode is rotated H and one diode is rotated V so you have to rotate the prism pairs as well.

    i'm using this system in my rgb rig. these diodes are so crazy powerful that i don't care about losses. the intent was to get the best beam that i possibly could without resorting to fiber.

    Quote Originally Posted by CDBEAM View Post
    Stuka... See attached pics....This is a experimental test set up I did to just experiment with knife edging in preparation for the Zod Quad. I would only use a PBS with a dual set up....like Swamidog's....NICE BEAM....no knife edging !! I cannot understand the beam shaping optics on the LD on the right....almost looks like cylinderical optics ??? or maybe Anamorphic Prisms turned 90 degree ???

    Anyway.....I MUST use knife edging to do a quad !!! My test set up uses Daves LD mounts and Flexmounts. My name for it ( MUST name everything ) is the Zod Dual...mmm or Zuul.....Of Course !!!

    I also do not understand why you would choose more optics loss by going thru two sets of beam shaping optics.....then go to combining ??? Perhaps SD can further explain his set up ?????But....his beam SURE looks great !!! That is for sure !!!

    Like I said....this is just a set up to experiment....B4 I drill and tap many, many mounting holes in Copper !!!

    Oh...And...Go with the JML PBS....I bet it is the best efficiency we are going to see !!!!! 97% efficiency on transmission and 95 % efficiency on reflectance !!!

    And for the asphericals...go with the O Like and Simons Prisms for beam shaping...ALL My opinion....subject to change daily !!! haha

    CDBEAM and Terrawatt
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

  2. #12
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    Thanx SD....Yes...The first set of Anamorphics are rotated 90 deg....as they would need to be....but...NOT to argue with a GREAT beam.....I dunno ??? Maybe the prisms work better when each beam is shaped first...THEN combined....I must think about this...Perhaps THIS IS the way to go....A while back....someone used two sets of prisms....on only one beam.....one set at 90 degree to the other. I have NEVER seen THIS set up B4....but...BOY....that beam dot looks good !!!

    CDBEAM

    OK...Did some Thinking....Ouch ... How about put one LD output thru a wave plate....that would allow for combining...and keep both axis in the same orientation....so the Anamorphics ( One Set ) could do their beam shaping ?? Optics loss may be the same ????? still going thru three optics....And yes !!! The best beam shape
    trumps everything else....I know we have had the wave plate, PBS then Prism set up done....I wonder which one
    outputs a better beam for a dual LD set up ???????????????????????????
    Last edited by CDBEAM; 09-20-2011 at 18:03. Reason: More Thinking !!!
    Beam Axiom #1 ~The Quantum well is DEEP ! Photons for ALL !!
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  3. #13
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    that spot is at 40'. the scorch marks on my wall attest to the energy density.

    Quote Originally Posted by CDBEAM View Post
    Thanx SD....Yes...The first set of Anamorphics are rotated 90 deg....as they would need to be....but...NOT to argue with a GREAT beam.....I dunno ??? Maybe the prisms work better when each beam is shaped first...THEN combined....I must think about this...Perhaps THIS IS the way to go....A while back....someone used two sets of prisms....on only one beam.....one set at 90 degree to the other. I have NEVER seen THIS set up B4....but...BOY....that beam dot looks good !!!

    CDBEAM
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    SD.....Your beam dot looks almost round ??? Rotating a set of A Prisms MUST be a real PITA.....Anyway.....My quest is mainly lies in the best beam geometry for a quad set up.....and my experiments are meant to educate myself on the mechanics of that area !! I would be VERY curious as to what dual set up gives the BEST geometry....and yours looks VERY good !!!

    Anyone else have any insight ???????????????????????

    CEBEAM
    Beam Axiom #1 ~The Quantum well is DEEP ! Photons for ALL !!
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    Beam Axiom #2 ~Yes...As a matter of fact...I DO wear tinfoil on my head !!
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    Beam Axiom #3 ~Whe'n dout...Po ah Donk awn et !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #4 ~A Chicken in every Pot, and a Laser Lumia in every Livingroom !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #5 ~"Abstract Photonic Expressionism"....is "Abstractonimical" !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #6 ~ "A Posse ad Essea" ~ From being possible to being actual ...is the beam target !

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    here is another interesting idea http://www.photonlexicon.com/forums/...t=beam+folding

    i think it is the best (but most fussy) solution
    "its called character briggs..."

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    Default Zuul Concept V 1.0

    OK then...I did a little sketch....my question is.....which set-up would deliver the best beam qeometry ...for a dual 445...Swamidog or the Zuul ??? SD's produces a great beam...no doubt !! But has anyone tried a concept like the design attached ??? if so.....what beam geometry at 30M....and what beam geometry at 30M for the SD design. Why 30M you say ??? Just a number which I think represents the farther limit of what most at PL would be interested in.

    All this is to answer Stuka question.....What is the best known current design for a dual 445 set-up ?? ...Dual sets of Anamorphic Prisms, then into a PBS....or.....One 445 LD into the PBS, the second 445 LD thru a waveplate to rotate the polarization...then on into the PBS.

    As of now....I would say that a dual does not need knife edging for sure...SD's design is the best I have seen for beam geometry....but I still wonder if that is the optimal. Yikes....I know Marc ( CT)...." How many coherent photons are on the head of a pin ? " hahaha
    CDBEAM
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Zuul Concept V 1.0   9.21.2011.JPG  

    Last edited by CDBEAM; 09-21-2011 at 12:12. Reason: More text
    Beam Axiom #1 ~The Quantum well is DEEP ! Photons for ALL !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #2 ~Yes...As a matter of fact...I DO wear tinfoil on my head !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #3 ~Whe'n dout...Po ah Donk awn et !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #4 ~A Chicken in every Pot, and a Laser Lumia in every Livingroom !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #5 ~"Abstract Photonic Expressionism"....is "Abstractonimical" !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #6 ~ "A Posse ad Essea" ~ From being possible to being actual ...is the beam target !

  7. #17
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    swamidog is online now Jr. Woodchuckington Janitor III, Esq.
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    your design will give you either a "_" or "=" shaped spot depending on the height relation of your diodes. mine gives a "+" that fuzzes into a round looking spot. the spot photo i posted is at 40'. that's the longest run available in my house.

    Quote Originally Posted by CDBEAM View Post
    OK then...I did a little sketch....my question is.....which set-up would deliver the best beam qeometry ...for a dual 445...Swamidog or the Zuul ??? SD's produces a great beam...no doubt !! But has anyone tried a concept like the design attached ??? if so.....what beam geometry at 30M....and what beam geometry at 30M for the SD design. Why 30M you say ??? Just a number which I think represents the farther limit of what most at PL would be interested in.

    All this is to answer Stuka question.....What is the best known current design for a dual 445 set-up ?? ...Dual sets of Anamorphic Prisms, then into a PBS....or.....One 445 LD into the PBS, the second 445 LD thru a waveplate to rotate the polarization...then on into the PBS.

    CDBEAM
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

  8. #18
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    Well...I am confused ( A normal state )...at 40' ( slightly over 12M )....a single 445 LD , with O-Like collimator, going thru a set of P1t8ull's prisms produces a ( VERY close to ) 14mm square. I have done this set up. By taking another 445 LD and passing thru a waveplate....one square is overlaid via the PBS on top of the other.

    Even if the square is slightly a rectangle...a very slight rectangle....then you would be comparing a fat plus shape that at 40' that looks like a circle.....to an almost square rectangle. I guess it them comes down to energy density/square mm vs. the geometry that most closely approaches a circle. I would speculate ( read quess ) that the Zuul would have just a bit more energy density....BUT the SD would look just more slightly like a circle. " Pay ya money...Takes ya pick " !!

    I dunno...just speculation ??? Likely at 40 feet...nobody could tell the difference.....and only the photonic obsessed would give a Rat's Ass.

    CDBEAM
    Last edited by CDBEAM; 09-21-2011 at 12:47. Reason: Added colour
    Beam Axiom #1 ~The Quantum well is DEEP ! Photons for ALL !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #2 ~Yes...As a matter of fact...I DO wear tinfoil on my head !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #3 ~Whe'n dout...Po ah Donk awn et !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #4 ~A Chicken in every Pot, and a Laser Lumia in every Livingroom !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #5 ~"Abstract Photonic Expressionism"....is "Abstractonimical" !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #6 ~ "A Posse ad Essea" ~ From being possible to being actual ...is the beam target !

  9. #19
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    i still think that the beam folding method produces the best results, especially if you are prepared to dive into pbs and waveplates anyway
    "its called character briggs..."

  10. #20
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    I would like to see a set-up of the beam folding !!! My mirrors are optically ground on the edge....but I question the abillity of the knife edge to slice the slow axis in half...and feed it back into itself ??? It seems that you can only get SO close to the edge...then the spill over losses start to suck !!! Hey...What do I know ????? Perhaps the optical grades we experiment with have their limitations....and components costing 25X do much better ????

    CDBEAM
    Beam Axiom #1 ~The Quantum well is DEEP ! Photons for ALL !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #2 ~Yes...As a matter of fact...I DO wear tinfoil on my head !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #3 ~Whe'n dout...Po ah Donk awn et !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #4 ~A Chicken in every Pot, and a Laser Lumia in every Livingroom !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #5 ~"Abstract Photonic Expressionism"....is "Abstractonimical" !!
    .
    Beam Axiom #6 ~ "A Posse ad Essea" ~ From being possible to being actual ...is the beam target !

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