Laser displays/shows - UK laws - Help?

[jian725]

Hi Bill ,
Yes,that real can let the scanner work again. :P
Problem is the driver must re-adjust.
That is so hard work .
BUT maybe that is not a problem,because most China scanners not precision :P

JIAN

[Pangolin]

Hi Jian,

My epoxy trick was suggested for these LaTu scanners. On those scanners, there are only two adjustments (besides gain which is obvious).

I honestly doubt they would need to be tweaked significantly after the epoxy application. Don't forget, I am talking about a thin layer of epoxy here...

Anyway, if someone needs to adjust them, it would only be like 1/4 turn clockwise on the Damping control. More advanced scanner amps have two damping controls which would be more difficult for the average Joe to adjust...

Bill

[jian725]

All right 8) 8) 8)

[aijii]

Audience scanning is a norm over here.
With the cheap chinese lasers available I have seen quite a few of the 'town centre' pubs using them.

Jim

Yep , i'm sure there are.. just as there are here in Melbourne. But that doesn't make it okay. I bet the designers of those Chinese laser projectors don't even know what "MPE" is...

a 100mw 532nm laser is pretty powerful i can light a match form 27metres, but once scanning it becomes ok.

No it doesn't. Just scanning a beam around a large area doesn't ensure it is safe. I'm not going to go into detail because frankly there is too much to type and I am at work, pretending to be doing work....

Just have a look around the pangolin links that Bill posted above for more info - but its a pretty hefty subject....

good luck

[Banthai]

Ok .... If you are realy REALY serious about doing laser shows in front of Realy REAL people ..... in to their Realy REAL eye balls here in the UK ... you need to understand
what the dangers are .... I hope that I dont come across patronising ... but all i want to do is share my concern for shining a very damaging beam into peoples eyes .... as Bill said in this post .... "check out the the Theses of John O'Hagan from the UK National Radiologocal Protection Board." this Guy loves laser shows .... But he wants laser shows to be performed within safe limits .... and if you read all he says .... they can be ...

But it takes a lot of work .... but thats the way it needs to be ... all the shows i have done have been on a hobby/unpaid basis ( although everyone thinks its a PRO show ) all the shows have followed the Risk assement that Mr O'Hagan has laid out ....

I have felt that it is very very important ....

Apart from studying the documentaion of John O'Hagan I also went on a course in Kent (uk) at a company that specialises in Laser Operator Training and i found was also a great day in meeting other laser operators

The guy that did the course was James Stuart at LaserVisuals and in one day I learnt more than i could learn in months ...

the link to the course is Below .... it cost me £290 .... for a full days course .... BUT it was money well spent and you get really good handbooks ... I would recomend it to anyone who wants to do laser shows in public in the UK

The next course is in early 2007

http://www.laservisuals.com/training.htm


Hope this all helps ..... all the best .... KARL

[QUAZAR]

Also bear in mind that ALL public laser shows need to be reported (in advance) to the Environmental Health Dept at the local Council. Some councils will do nothing after receiving your submission, others will impose a whole host of conditions you will have to meet before giving you permission to do a show.

[Banthai]

Yes ... What Quazar said ( and I forgot to mention ) is probably one of the most important factors ....

The Local council needs your venue risk assesment and show/equipment/power specifications
although to be honest most EHO at the councils dont understand the documents they will tend to be happy if you have provided
the information ... the chances are that if you dont you could get a visit half an hour before show time from a EHO who will shut down the show
because it "may be unsafe" you as the operator will then have to prove otherwise.... having the shows MPE calcs and risk assessment on hand can get you out of trouble .... although not always .... I have known an EHO to then start questioning about the haze fluid used in the hazer and then ask you to produce documention to prove its safe .... they always like to find something

Talking about smoke n haze ..... I have seen a lot of new premises licence aplictions ( that every venue has to have now due to the change in the licencing laws ) the councils now impose a condition for strobes, Lasers, and smoke machines ....

No explosive, liquefied petroleum gas or any other highly flammable materials shall be used or stored on the premises unless notified to the Licensing Authority and is used in accordance any guidance given by Lancashire Fire Service.

No pyrotechnics including fireworks shall be used or stored at the premises unless notified to the Licensing Authority and they are used in accordance with any guidance given by Lancashire Fire Service.

No dry ice machines or cryogenic fog smoke machines or fog generators shall be used at the premises unless notified to the Licensing Authority and used in accordance any guidance given by Lancashire Fire Service.

Lasers shall only be used on the premises in accordance with the requirements for the safe use of lasers as set down in the HSE Guide, The Radiation of Safety Lasers Used for Display Purposes [HS (G) 95] and BS 60825: Safety of Laser products British Standard 4803: part 3.

No strobe light shall be used in the premises unless a notice which can be clearly seen and easily read warning that strobe lights are in use in the premises is displayed at each entrance to the premises.

the above is from our local council venue aplications ...

an our council is very laid back compared to the majority ....

Also the smoking ban when it comes in will cause a big headache for laser and lightshow operators ... due to the fact that...
1, we will be seen to be poluting the air inside a venue,
2, staff and audience will blame us and not the smokers for a sore throats and not feeling well,
3, councils will require details on all substances used in smoke machines before you use them
4, ( the most important ) All newly built venues will be fitted with smoke detectors intead of heat detectors ( as the smokers have prevented designers from doing this in the past ) and then it will be ileagal to bypass the smoke detector or disable it ( using a polythene bag and elastic band ... which i have seen done :cry: )

so the fact is its tough to do it now and it will get even harder in the future

all the best ......... KARL

[JimBo]

The place where I am doing gigs has just had a total refit, including the fire alarm system.
Every sunday they have a Country and Western show complete with a shoot out at the end, because of this the function room is the only one with heat detectors rather than smoke detectors so at present I am ok using haze

Jim

[JimBo]

Does anybody have a sample risk assessment that I can look at?
I've never actually done one for my disco or lasers, I think I'd better do one because I expect it is required with my public liability insurance.

Jim

[Banthai]

Hi jimbo

I have used this

http://www.pangolin.com/SafetyTheses/Appendix_F.pdf

Basicaly just remove the parts that are not aplicable to you, and anything that you feel that is not covered, include
a risk assessment is just common sense, sometimes just stating the obvious, and covering your own arse to make sure that you are
doing things by the book ....

Anything that is variable ( venue / promotor etc ) you can leave a blank space ..... and fill out for the gig ... non variable stuff like equipment can be filled in permantly on the master copy and only updated when it needs to be

also if you have a regular Gig at the same venue and your Equipment / venue layout / promotor does not change
you can use the same risk asessment and change the date ..... obviously if you see something unsafe at the venue ( badly fitted Parcans or incorrect wiring or fire exits blocked or locked etc ... ) its worth reporting it to the promotor and noting in the asessment the problem, and that you have reported it, as it covers your own arse.

once you have a standard risk assesment in place its only takes a few minute to complete for each gig

but any problems ( fires, injurys, insurance claims ) it can save a lot of time / money

All the best ....... Karl