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Thread: ILDA 2015 Dubai 10/9 LSO Class

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Brooklyn, NY

    Default ILDA 2015 Dubai 10/9 LSO Class

    Hey all,

    I could use guidance about the many things I don't know about this class.

    I live in NYC where I cannot operate lasers for concerts without a certificate of competence issued to me by the NY Labor Commissioner under his Code Rule 50. I am assuming this ILDA LSO Safety class taught by Greg Makhov satisfies the requisite for receiving that certificate.

    I would be flying a long way to Dubai just to take the LSO class on Friday the 9th but I won't be staying for the rest of the conference. Can I register for this class without needing to register for the full conference?

    What should I expect in terms of the material on the exam itself? I have been studying Ken Barat's "Laser Safety Management" book + Sam's Laser FAQ sections on safety and wonder if that will be enough to cover my basics and bring me up to speed for the LSO course or if I need to look elsewhere. Other threads here indicate this exam is overwhelming for beginners.

    ILDA Conference registration page says: "To take this class, you must have prior laser show experience, or have taken ILDA's Laser Operator Safety course. If you have questions whether you are ready for this class, contact the instructor." It also seems like the conference won't be offering a Laser Operator Safety course to bring attendees up to speed for the LSO course like I have seen at other conferences - is this still the case? Where does one take the Laser Operator Safety course? I have limited show experience and wouldn't want to try throwing any here without passing the exam first.

    I feel solid behind concepts like MPE, divergence, wavelength etc. (thanks to Ken's book) but my math skills are not the strongest so I hope using online calculators will suffice to complete the equations on the test. Or will I need a scientific calculator too? How much of the test is calculating equations vs. answering general safety knowledge? I only ask for tips since it's kind of daunting to invest and fly out like this without knowing what you're getting yourself into.

    I'm only going out of the way since it's the only class of its kind. Considering the cost of the flight + hotel, would it just make more sense to take a custom course in Orlando? I'm not sure if those custom courses are also taught by Greg nor how to register for that course.

    Any advice you can provide would be very much appreciated!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Brooklyn NYC


    wow your planning on flying to dubai just for the LSO class thats nuts but anyway the answer to your question is no it will not satisfy the code 50 requirement you need too take class specifically on code rule 50 while greg's lso course is great to teach general and advanced laser safety practices it will not have any of the NY specific stuff furthermore its not an approved course by the Ny department of labor
    by the way im NY class B operator in brooklyn aswell

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Charleston, SC


    If you want to see Dubai, the ILDA conference is probably one of the better ways to do so. But if you are only going to Dubai to take the LSO class, I would suggest you save your money and take the class in Florida instead at some later date. Even if you had to pay for extra empty slots just so Greg would run a class just for you at his shop in Orlando, I think you would still come out ahead financially. (A ticket to Dubai has got to be at least $1500, if not more, and I'm sure hotels aren't cheap over there either.)

    Also, as stated above, the ILDA course will not satisfy all the requirements for New York. Nevertheless, the ILDA LSO class is *highly* recommended for all laserists. We have even had several hobbyists take the class, even though they have no plans to do commercial shows. The class is just that good!


  4. #4
    Bradfo69's Avatar
    Bradfo69 is online now Pending BST Forum Purchases: $47,127,283.53
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Wilmington, DE


    ^ What they said! I'll bet if you paid Greg 75% of what going to Dubai is going to cost, he'd be happy to spend a day teaching it to you in Orlando! And probably buy you lunch! And you're still ahead financially!
    PM Sent...

  5. #5
    mixedgas's Avatar
    mixedgas is online now Creaky Old Award Winning Bastard Technologist
    Infinitus Excellentia Ion Laser Dominatus
    Join Date
    May 2007
    A lab with some dripping water on the floor.


    The ILDA test is open book. You also are allowed a calculator.
    In fact you'll NEED the provided sheet of equations during the test. It is a fairly tough , but limited scope, physics test. The math does not approach algebra, you really just need to know squares, and square roots, and powers of ten.
    It helps if you have done a few laser shows as the hardware setup guy, there are some questions based on your intuitive understanding of how an actual show setup works. Preferably one where you tried to achieve/attempt FDA compliance or an outdoor gig. That is what Greg will probably ask about before your allowed to take the test.
    Unless I really wanted to spend vacation in Dubai, I'd make my way to Orlando. Greg's shop is 15 minutes from Pangolin's location. If Bill Benner is around to give a tour, it is worth it to spend an hour or two at Pangolin.
    The NYS Class B acceptable courses are only taught by a few NYS approved instructors.

    Steve , ILDA Certified LSO.
    Last edited by mixedgas; 09-08-2015 at 16:01.
    Qui habet Christos, habet Vitam!
    I should have rented the space under my name for advertising.
    When I still could have...

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Brooklyn NYC


    for the NY test it is not open book you need to remember the equations and charts but you can use a sci calc (just not one with equation memory like TE) also you need to know a bunch non laser show related stuff like for surveying,construction laser use(ie spinning laser level for drop ceiling )and trenching etc also there is a lot of very old laser info needed about old ions etc (the test was written in the 70's and not updated) you need to know all the wavelengths for ar, kr,hene,hecad ect...
    also there is some biology on the test (human eye )

    i sent a message to the person that i took the course from (norman ballard from rarefied media production ) asking when he is giving his next course but he has not gotten back to me yet

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Brooklyn NYC


    Section 61-5.3 Certification. (a) Classifications of certificates of competence. There
    shall be two classifications of certificates of competence issued to operators of mobile
    lasers, as follows:
    (1) Class A (Restricted). The holder of a Class A certificate of
    competence may operate any low-intensity mobile laser.
    (2) Class B (Unrestricted). The holder of a Class B certificate of
    competence may operate any high-intensity or low-intensity mobile
    (b) Certification required. No individual shall operate a mobile laser unless such
    individual is either a certified mobile laser operator working within the scope
    of the individual’s certified classification or a trainee working under the direct
    supervision of a certified operator and within the scope of the operator’s
    certified classification. No owner, employer, contractor, or agent, shall
    knowingly permit any individual to act as a laser operator unless such
    individual is either a certified mobile laser operator working within the scope
    of the individual’s certified classification or a trainee working under the direct
    supervision of the certified operator and within the scope of the operator’s
    certified classification.
    (c) Responsibilities of certified mobile laser operators. Every certified mobile
    laser operator shall be responsible for complying with the reporting and
    recordkeeping requirements and the standards of conduct of this Subpart at
    sections 61-5.7 and 61-5.8 below.
    Section 61-5.4 Qualifications. The general provisions set forth at section 61-1.4 shall
    apply under this Subpart except as follows:
    (a) Experience. Every applicant for a certificate of competence shall have at
    least one year of practical experience in the operation of a laser. Such
    required experience may be obtained by a trainee who is designated by and
    working under the direct supervision of a certified mobile laser operator.
    Such experience shall include knowledge of laser safety precautions and
    shall be acceptable to the Commissioner. The Commissioner may waive the
    one-year experience requirement if the applicant submits evidence of his
    successful completion of a laser operator training course acceptable to the
    Section 61-5.5 Certification procedures. The general provisions set forth at section
    61-1.5 shall apply under this Subpart except as follows:
    (a) Investigations. For certifications under this Subpart, all applicants shall pass
    an eye examination as specified by the Commissioner. The requirements of
    Subpart 61-1.5(a)(3) shall not be applicable to applicants for certification as
    Mobile Laser Operators.
    (b) Examination. Each applicant for a certificate of competence shall, and each
    applicant for a renewal of such certificate may, be required by the
    Commissioner to take an appropriate written examination.
    (c) Issuance of certificates without examination. The Commissioner may issue a
    certificate of competence or a renewal thereof without examination of any
    kind to any applicant who:
    (1) has successfully completed a four-year course of study at a college or
    university which included a study of lasers and laser safety precautions
    and such course is acceptable to the Commissioner; or
    (2) has filed an application for a certificate of competence prior to
    February 1, 1973 and has submitted along with such application
    evidence of adequate experience with lasers and with laser safety
    precautions and who, in the judgment of the Commissioner, meets all
    other qualifications required for certification as a competent mobile
    laser operator.

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