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Thread: Ilda Digital Network (IDN)

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    Default Ilda Digital Network (IDN)

    The 2015 Ilda conference brought us something else than awards for laserists: the new IDN standard!

    http://www.laserist.org/StandardsDoc...eam_rev001.pdf

    It's designed to be a way to stream laser art over digital standards such as ethernet. In that way the old analog ilda cable and connector can be deprecated in favor of ethernet controllers on stage or better, inside the projector directly. It also means OS-specific USB drivers can now go in the trash can where they belong.

    After a first glance over the document, here are some of my findings:

    - Signals are now split over things called channels, I believe there can be 64 channels simultaneously
    - Rather than specifying which channel does what like with the analog standard (eg pin 1 is X+, pin 2 is Y+ etc) channel assignment is now fully flexible and should be agreed on between the "producer" (the laser program) and the "consumer" (the control board).
    - This allows for a uniform way to handle multiple projector setups, no channels are wasted on projectors that only have a green module and there is no longer a limitation on the amount of colours in a projector
    - You can also send DMX512 signals over it in the same way as a laser channel
    - Same for static effects like bounce mirrors and gratings and such
    - There's a distinction between continous point stream (like an analog module) and per-frame streaming
    - There is no dedicated shutter channel anymore, the shutter is supposed to go down when no signal is received automatically
    - There does not appear to be a way for the consumer to send status signals back to the laser program. It would probably cause too much headache to implement this on every DAC but things like interlock status, temperature, maybe even scanner feedback signal for advanced auto-tuning algorithms would be very neat if they could get sent back to the computer
    - somebody at Ilda has difficulties discerning its and it's


    The only thing to hope for now is that the big manufacturers implement this, if not as the standard way to send things then at least as an option. I'm of course looking at that one manufacturer that is currently persuading every Chinese manufacturer out there to equip their projectors with their new ethernet controller.

    It should now also be possible to send laser data from one program to another seamlessly.

    Whaddy'all think?

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    Looks like I have some reading to do.

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    It's exciting to see this go forward as a standard. We've been using the little interfaces that implement this protocol for a while on our Laser Effects Safety Analysis system, http://www.facebook.com/LaserSafety . Dexlogic manufacture and sell two external converters, http://www.dexlogic.de/products/IDN-en.html . One converts the IDN digital stream to a 25w ILDA port, and is intended to allow IDN to directly control the traditional ILDA DB25 input to a laser projector. (Essentially working as an IDN DAC, having an Ethernet connection in and ILDA analogue out). There is another external interface converter available that does the opposite and converts the analogue output of any controller to an IDN stream. i.e. an ADC. (We use this as a convenient way of capturing projector signals, although the real intention is to allow analogue systems to connect to IDN.


    Both these devices are legacy devices, providing a bridge to the analogue controls that already exist. Going forward Dexlogic have a projector based interface that allows manufacturers to put IDN functionality in their projectors, so from a user's perspective all that needs to be done is have software that outputs the IDN protocol via its network link, and provide that link to the projectors.


    I'm am aware that some projector manufacturers have demonstrated product with IDN input. We now need to wait and see if other interface manufacturers start to implement this protocol and make more hardware options available. And of course software authors!


    James
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    we just played my LSX shows at ILDA using IDN. it worked and looked fantastic.
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by swamidog View Post
    we just played my LSX shows at ILDA using IDN. it worked and looked fantastic.
    Did you use a modified .dll that showed up like one of the regular supported DACs in LSX but actually converts the frames to IDN? Could you give a bit more information? It would be really useful to have something that produces IDN for people who might be interested in making more software for it.

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    The dedicated Dexlogic hardware decoder that sets in the projector starts at 350$ or so for the OEM version....
    The dedicated Dexlogic encoder starts at ~400 USD...
    He has FPGA code on the site as well..
    So what are the software options that run on a PC to support the standard?
    .
    .
    Here is a used set on Ebay:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Laser-ILDA-D...item234d12a705
    .
    The above device pair is really an ILDA + DMX over Ethernet set...

    .
    .

    Steve
    Last edited by mixedgas; 10-12-2015 at 11:34.
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    we played shows from dynamics, medialase, and LSX using modified drivers and the IDN module as the dacs.

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedgas View Post
    The dedicated Dexlogic hardware decoder that sets in the projector starts at 350$ or so for the OEM version....
    The dedicated Dexlogic encoder starts at ~400 USD...
    He has FPGA code on the site as well..
    So what are the software options that run on a PC to support the standard?
    .
    .
    Here is a used set on Ebay:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Laser-ILDA-D...item234d12a705
    .
    The above device pair is really an ILDA + DMX over Ethernet set...

    .
    .

    Steve
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    And where do us mere mortals get the plugin for LSX?

    Steve
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    swamidog's Avatar
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    talk to Matthias Frank


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedgas View Post
    And where do us mere mortals get the plugin for LSX?

    Steve
    suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JStewart View Post
    It's exciting to see this go forward as a standard. We've been using the little interfaces that implement this protocol for a while on our Laser Effects Safety Analysis system, http://www.facebook.com/LaserSafety . Dexlogic manufacture and sell two external converters, http://www.dexlogic.de/products/IDN-en.html . One converts the IDN digital stream to a 25w ILDA port, and is intended to allow IDN to directly control the traditional ILDA DB25 input to a laser projector. (Essentially working as an IDN DAC, having an Ethernet connection in and ILDA analogue out). There is another external interface converter available that does the opposite and converts the analogue output of any controller to an IDN stream. i.e. an ADC. (We use this as a convenient way of capturing projector signals, although the real intention is to allow analogue systems to connect to IDN.


    Both these devices are legacy devices, providing a bridge to the analogue controls that already exist. Going forward Dexlogic have a projector based interface that allows manufacturers to put IDN functionality in their projectors, so from a user's perspective all that needs to be done is have software that outputs the IDN protocol via its network link, and provide that link to the projectors.


    I'm am aware that some projector manufacturers have demonstrated product with IDN input. We now need to wait and see if other interface manufacturers start to implement this protocol and make more hardware options available. And of course software authors!


    James
    I glanced over the document for the first time this morning and noticed it really only talked about the data content and not the transport mechanism. I need to get into the details but right now I am wondering how this works for multiple devices. Let's say there are 10 projectors and 10 DMX fixtures that are to be controlled. Is the intent for some device to capture this stream and send distribute it to the various projectors and fixtures? Or is it intended to be so that each fixture has its own controller that listens for this stream and handles the portion that is intended for it? Or is it a combination where some device might handle a set of fixtures? Or, is that totally undefined and left up to the implementer? Is there a 2nd part coming that defines how this should behave over ethernet so that someone could create compatible hardware that is plug and play or is that in the details of the current document? Maybe these questions will be answered as I read on but these are my questions at the moment.

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