How do they get away with it?

[planters]

If you are correct then this is ridiculous. We are the public. The lack of a rated or specified power is a problem just like a failure to place a specified HP on a gas engine or a required input/output voltage on a transformer. It is sloppy or misleading, but it is not a terrible sin.

God i wish people would stop blaming pointers for the stupid acts that people do

Stop wishing and realize that this whole hoax is coming down from the top. Global warming, domestic terror, any tiny residual respect for what the media presents as fact and the value to this country from the Clinton and Bush families are all crap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJyf1IrHtcE

Better regulate these as well. Oh, and encryption, we have to regulate that of course. What else, let me think... Oh ya, better pretend that medical marijuana is primarily medical and not actually recreational. That way we can slip this in. God forbid we can just be honest for a change. And, of course we need to CONTROL the drones.

White-light,
Do you think Britain will vote to exit the EU?

[White-Light]

I personally have no axe to grind. I don't really see the point in pointers, but equally they've never affected me. Just passing on what appears to be FDA Regulation that already exists. Interestingly, from memory of what I read, if it isn't labelled or is incorrectly labelled, it's also illegal.

As to the EU point Eric, I really don't know how it will end. The rich boys and government are out in force about the threat of leaving and how leaving the EU will cost Britain loads of jobs and make us unemployed. The PM is literally touring big businesses and giving lectures to the captive work force about the dangers of leaving and how it threatens their jobs. They're really bullying people in my opinion. Somehow personally, I think them wanting to stay has more do with the fact that they'd lose their source of cheap labour with which to force wages down to minimum wage, and so their wages would go down whilst everyone else's might go up.

A free trade agreement is all that's needed and given that some of the UK's EU partners have already said they need the UK in the EU, I can't see why the UK wouldn't be able to get this.

I will be voting to leave as I've more than had enough of the EU.

[planters]

The mayor of London is on your side. Exiting is not the equivalent of stockpiling can goods and living in a yurt. NAFTA hasn't helped the US and it is nothing compared to the intrusiveness of the EU. Good luck.

As to the pointer crowd, I would say that there is really no point to any of the lasers discussed here. Projectors, re-purposed medical lasers and experimental scratch builds are simply...fun. The fact that some make a profit from building these or using them does not change the fact that it is still the fun that drives people to pay to own or see them. The same could be said for a pointer (for those that like them).

FDA requires that manufacturers of these lasers limit the power of the laser light to 5 milliWatts (often abbreviated as "mW") or less.

This is what concerns me. They do not say that those above 5mw must be labeled; they say they must be less than 5mW...period. Am I reading this correctly? Some individual diodes sold by DTR are more than 1000 times this limit.

[Draco]

The reason DTR can sell diodes, is the individual parts of a laser are not regulated in the USA, we can buy what ever parts we want, it's when they are assembled and used at a public event or sold is where we come to the point we need to have a variance from the FDA.

I personally think it's hypocritical to go after laser pointers when our own projectors are indeed illegal to use at public events unless you have a variance.

I my self like laser pointers and own a few of the ones sold on the mentioned website but as i stated before this website is misleading and that is a problem, the laser is a 301 type you can get on e-bay for about 10 bucks, they have a key lock on the tail if you are concerned about a child getting a hold of one, some are all over the place when it comes to power output, some are 5mw but some are cranked up to the point of 20-30mw and don't operate long at that power before failure, they are what you pay for. they do have a sticker on the side that says 5mw and some are of that power but have very poor quality.

that website did stop selling high power laser pointers last year so for those anti pointer people you can relax a bit, take a Valium and do something more productive with there time

[planters]

we need to have a variance from the FDA

Where did this terminology originate? It is peculiar. Rather than a license as with a boat or a car, what is varying? I have my suspicions, but I 'm looking for an answer without suggesting any.

I generally agree with your post. It is the goofy premise such as the nitric acid is fine and the glycerin is cheap and a fuse can be had almost anywhere, but these things have a lot of other, unrelated purposes. What are you going to do with a 5W blue diode, Hmm?

[Draco]

when i used the term "variance" it is basically for home made equipment, i got the term from an employer of mine that does home made builds, I guess it's the same as a permit to use that projector that is home made. the FDA wants all the gooey info about your build, you submit it to the FDA and they inturn give you permission to use that projector in public shows provided it meets all the needed rules for laser projectors, my employer i believe calls it a variance. we need todo this for all of our laser show projectors, be it lumina, line generators and projectors we also assign a name for the model and a serial number as well even if it's a one off build . its varying from the normal way a manufacture would get permission to use there factory made projectors in the USA.
and Planters i know where you are going with the nitric acid and glycerin, i tried that as a teen, the reaction went out of control and i dumped the batch, that was in the early 1990, these days i would get locked up for such an experiment, making that stuff is really dangerous, i do have my chemicals still but i use them for other things, nitric acid is great at etching silver and you can make art from that, but i also have toluene and sulfuric acid that i use for other things in legal ways, toluene is great for thinning the glues i used to repair speakers but all of this stuff can be used to make TNT so i store the stuff in other rooms and document what i am doing with them for my own safety, they are all called precursors

[flecom]

what??

21 CFR 1040.10(b)(13) says all demonstration laser products will be IIIa (<5mW) the variance is a permission to disobey/vary from that rule in a demonstration laser product

ALL laser products that can emit >5mW (IIIb/IV) require a variance, has nothing to do with being home made

[White-Light]

and Planters i know where you are going with the nitric acid and glycerin, i tried that as a teen, the reaction went out of control and i dumped the batch, that was in the early 1990, these days i would get locked up for such an experiment, making that stuff is really dangerous,

Ha ha. Yeah we did the experiment in school for our advanced level exams along with the other ingredient. Can't see it being allowed these days especially as the Acid is so conc. + the other reason. Keep it under 30 degrees and you make something harmless, that was our aim. Get it over 30 degrees (which is very hard not to because it's exothermic) and you make something undesirable. I seem to remember ice cubes in a water bath and a slow titration to make the intended product. You've never seen so many students in 1 lesson sh*t themselves because the reaction was running away!

Can't imagine elf and safety would let you within a million miles of it these days. I wouldn't like to go within a million miles of the acid these days either, especially not with kids around. There were some right idiots at my previous school.

We also did several experiments with hydrofluoric. That stuff on it's own, used to scare the sh*t out of me.

[Draco]

Acids are a lot of fun....

[planters]

ice cubes in a water bath and a slow titration to make the intended product.

Yes. Slow Slow Slow!

the variance is a permission to disobey/vary from that rule in a demonstration laser product

Ya, that's what I thought. With all the greater threats we face daily, how kind to dispense this privilege.