Hope this isn't controversial... Video showing EMS8000 with 6mm mirrors

[Pangolin]

Hehe. I'm not sure what is clarified and what is not. I reported my experience and shone some light on actual specifications and highlighted the fact that if you remove material from the back side of a mirror, you're going to warp the mirror. Other than that, I'm not sure what's so clear...

Bill

[rns0504]

The screenshot attached (areas of interest highlighted) advertise these as 60K @ 8 degrees, with a 6mm beam

[planters]

Bill,
The projector in the above post seems way over priced and now is suspect for being way over spec-ed as well.

What about ordering a few projectors that are advertised with EMS scanners and retrofitting a Saturn scanner and demo-ing these side by side at a show and/or on YouTube? The manufacturer will be hard pressed not to offer Saturn as an "upgrade".

[catalanjo]

HB is now a laserwurld company!
Specs are just for "general guidance" !!!!! and shouldn´t be taken too "literally".
In my experience most of the interesting bits are what are NOT EVER included in the specs......like internal case or component temps compared to ambient temp for example!
Cheers

[rns0504]

Specs shouldnt be taken too literally?

In this case the scanners are advertised to do 60K at 8 degrees and they really only do around 30K at 8 degrees

What if Chevrolet told everyone their new car gets 50 miles per gallon (or whatever scale you want to use) and once peole got it home they found it really only gets 25 miles per gallon?

And Chevrolet said "oh well our specs are just for general guidance and not to be taken literally"

Wouldnt go over too well would it?

Especially when this laser costs more than a brand new Chevrolet!

[catalanjo]

Don´t worry about it mate, ...I don´t think LW is thinking of buying Chevrolet in the near future!
Cheers

[swamidog]

are those specs from EMS or from HB-Laser?

looking at the sadly defunct one stop page i see:

Eye-Magic Infinity EMS 8000 Scanners

Set includes:

2 EMS-8000 Infinity 60K Scanners with 99% Dielectric Mirrors
2 EMA-2000 Servo Amplifier Cards
1 Scanner Mount (Left & Right Beam Input)
2 Cables Sets (Scanner to Servo, Power, and Signal)
Supports 3.8.0mm apertures
60 Degree Scan Angle

Specs shouldnt be taken too literally?

In this case the scanners are advertised to do 60K at 8 degrees and they really only do around 30K at 8 degrees

What if Chevrolet told everyone their new car gets 50 miles per gallon (or whatever scale you want to use) and once peole got it home they found it really only gets 25 miles per gallon?

And Chevrolet said "oh well our specs are just for general guidance and not to be taken literally"

Wouldnt go over too well would it?

Especially when this laser costs more than a brand new Chevrolet!

[rns0504]

I posted the HB specs. The Eye Magic page has nothing about this scanner (that I can find at least). I'd be interested to find the specs direct from EMS if someone has a link

60K with a 3.something mirror seems plausable

[swamidog]

agreed. EMS is bad about posting specs.. and just about any other technical details.

it is possible HB got the specs wrong. we have seen in the past problems where vendors mistakenly post specs for the wrong mirror size.

I posted the HB specs. The Eye Magic page has nothing about this scanner (that I can find at least). I'd be interested to find the specs direct from EMS if someone has a link

60K with a 3.something mirror seems plausable

[Pangolin]

Let me step in here.

1. Historically HB has been a great company. We have a long relationship with them at Pangolin. HB was started by the technical wizard who formerly worked at LOBO. Great people, and generally great products too.

2. I've seen bad specs posted by good people in the past. Even Kvant was advertising 80 degree scan angle until I pointed it out to them. (Other companies still are...) I believe this comes from the "motor spec" itself. Cambridge advertises that the MOTOR (i.e. the galvo) can go 80 degrees. Heck, our scanners can go 110 degrees. But the optical scan angle achievable once you put mirrors on it is something completely different.

3. The video that I made shows my experience, nothing more. Moreover, it's the experience I had with a scanning system that doesn't even belong to us -- belongs to a customer who asked that we replace one of their mirrors.

Nevertheless, knowing optical scanners and having derived the specs, I don't believe that a scanner manufactured with Cambridge 6800-like construction and 6800-like specifications and a 2mm shaft would be able to drive mirrors for a 6mm aperture at 60K and 8 degrees. If that happens let me know, and we'll put whatever magical dust they use on our scanners ;-)

4. I've taken another look at the advertisement Ryan found. Actually this could be a case of clever advertising. It says "Scanner" and then says 60K at 8 degrees. It is a completely separate place where it says "Beam specification: 6mm". If the EMS800 is used by itself, with tiny mirrors, and with no regard for what we call "Quality of motion", then it may be possible for these scanners (all by themselves) to go 60K at 8 degrees. The advertiser could thus clear that what they've advertised is not an exaggeration. The scanners (all by themselves) can go 60K at 8 degrees, and the laser has a 6mm beam. At no point in the advertisement did they actually say that these particular scanners driving those particular mirrors would go any speed.

Nevertheless, if this is the tact, they're certainly not helping clarify things for the marketplace. But then again, is it their responsibility to clarify things for the marketplace? You tell me...

In any event, it shows what we're up against. At Pangolin we really want to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth about our products and specifications. But the truth can be so much less exciting than fantasy!

Bill