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Cross platform code is not all that it is cracked up to be. If you really need to support every OS out there that is one thing but if you don't then it is just a headache. I don't mean to be smug but take a look at laser boy software. It is generic and probably can run on a calculator but it looks like a 1980s DOS program and doesn't even offer the normal type of things that any basic modern program would offer such as menus or even mouse support.
But regardless, .NET code IS cross platform code if you want it to be! Look into the MONO project if you don't believe me. The .NET application I work on at work runs on Windows, Solaris, and Red Hat linux.
Before you go bashing someone's work or the technology they are using you should probably research it a little.
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It's LaserBoy !!!
I never bashed your work and I never will.
BTW It's LaserBoy; one word, with a capital L and a capital B, optionally followed by one or more exclaimation points.
"looks like a 1980s DOS program"
No. It looks more like a 1970s UNIX Super Computer Application.
I'm very proud of the look and feel of LaserBoy. I'm glad it uses nothing but the keyboard. It is different and it immediately makes you think of laser applications in a different "light". It certainly isn't a copy of anything else that is already out there. It uses EVERY pixel to show you relevant information; not to provide you with things to click on.
No menus? It's ALL menus! I must say, that I have just made huge improvements in the way the menus respond. The next release of LaserBoy will be WAY more intuitive and easy to use.
Rather than looking at it for what it is not, you should take a look at what it is and does. Other people seem to find it useful.
I feel most comfortable programming in an environment that is mostly of my own making. I have never liked to write code that depends on all kinds of widgets that exist in someone else's closed, proprietary library.
Yes, I use SDL! But at least it's open. And the only thing that I use from it is its ability to give me keyboard hits and it's ability to give me a pointer to some display area. I do EVERYTHING else in my own code. That's why it didn't take me very long to learn about SDL and port it.
I have done a lot of research in my quest to find happiness in programming. Generic C/C++ via GNU GCC is it. It is truly a beautiful thing! If God wanted us to program in C# or Java, He wouldn't have created UNIX or Brian Kernighan, Dennis Ritchie and Bjarne Stroustrup!
James. 
Last edited by James Lehman; 06-03-2008 at 15:34.
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Stop it please.
You are both doing a good job.
We need more people like you both to progress free applications for editing/displaying/showing and what ever else you want to do with laser files and give the "Professionals" a run for their money and make them think about what us laserists really want out of the software, rather than what they think we want and proprietry file formats.
Andre
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He started it! :P
(How do I get raspberrys on this thing anyway?)
OK, maybe I started it.
James.
Last edited by James Lehman; 06-03-2008 at 15:51.
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The Gimp is a good example of a reatively modern cross-platform program that is comlex and graphical interface driven. Just because a program's cross platform doesn't mean it has to look like a DOS app. Anyway I will say that when I went to install Spaghetti, and found it needed .net XXX my first thought was 'oh no' but it certainly does make the programming 'easier.' I just wish the same simplifications that .net accomplishes were publicly available in a open C++ repository so that the extra luggage (processor cycles and ram) that a .net library sucks up could be thinned out. Typically .net apps that I install are 2-3x larger, slower, and more RAM hungry than the same app in C.
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There it is!
Years ago I got so freaked out about LaserBoy being stuck in Linux that I actually went out and bought a book! 
It was all about C++ and The CLI. (Common Language Infrastructure) In this book was a detailed description of how Microsoft managed to make it irrelevant as to what language you chose to write applications. It doesn't matter if it's Visual Basic or Visual C++ or C#, as long as it was Microsoft, it's all the same thing! It went on to describe how they completely changed all the rules of C++ to trim it down to conform with the limitations of BASIC! I almost had tears in my eyes! What have they done to my beautiful C++ ??? Ruining another wonderful idea of computer science is not something I want to be a part of. Microsoft HAS made it easy. That's not such a good thing. It turns the art of programming into plastic flower arranging.
James.
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.NET is not 2-3x slower than C. In fact in some cases it is faster because it is compiled on the computer it runs on and targets the specific CPU and optimizes accordingly. It MAY use more RAM because of the way garbage collection works. It typically will gobble up RAM and release it when it sees fit. But, it only uses what is free and will release before exceeding that.
.NET requires a lot of framework components to be installed but they are part of Vista anyway and will be a part of future MS operating systems. So, in the future, there will not be additional baggage because it will be part of the OS. It's no different than Delphi, C++, or any other language requiring their runtime files. .NET just has more because it is more feature rich.
I'm a bit tired of the whining about having to install .NET or DirectX or needing XP SP2 or Vista so I'll probably just pull the plug on the a free version of Spaghetti and only work on it to suit me. If I can release it later and make some money on it I will but otherwise it's going on the shelf.
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great, now who will support my opensource dac
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Haha. I have to admit that you always amuse me with your anti-Microsoft posts. Your don't have your facts quite straight but that only makes them more entertaining.
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You can not possibly understand what Microsoft is all about until you have moved away from it completely.
My first job as a professional software engineer was 100% OS/2. This was after I had learned C and UNIX on Sun Spark Stations and had about 3 years of experience running an ISP in Linux.
I know what Microsoft is. And I know what it is not.
Microsoft is an easier OS for anyone who uses it because it is still a "Personal Computer" OS.
Every other major OS in use today is based on concepts of POSIX. In other words, they are "Main Frames".
There is a whole layer of OS structure that is completely missing in a PC OS.
In POSIX, the kernel knows how to recognize root and every other individual user (simultaneously) and the file system knows how to record file ownership and permissions. This is not fake. It is real. It is the foundation of the OS.
Originally, "Personal Computer" simplicity was the whole point! It was the only way to fit all that stuff into one small box for less that $10,000. Security was simple. Keep it in your office and keep the door locked!
Putting a PC on a network is insane... and it's the world standard.
Ever Since the I-80386, we have had a CPU that can do 32bit addressing and task switching. These things are necessary to run a main frame OS. That came out a long time ago!
No amount of BS running in "user space" on a PC OS can replace foundational concepts. That is fake and that can be easily violated with any other BS.
The only thing that keeps Microsoft on top is the fact that most people don't know squat about what a computer is or how it works. Once you really learn the concepts of POSIX, you'll see it for what it is.
James.
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Originally Posted by James Lehman
