General Pangolin chat

[Jem]

You can even use the linein: plugin to allow the beat detection engine to monitor the line-in port on your computer rather than having to play the music from Winamp itself. I can see this being a real boon for commercial shows where you've got a DJ mixing records all night... Just jack into the main mixing board, and poof! You've got a fully-automatic, beat-syncronized, full color laser show! Amazing...

Hey Adam

You don't even have to jack into the main mixing board... Just plug a microphone into the 'line in' on your PC and pick up whatever noise is going on in the room at the time. This is great for when you have your laser on stage projecting out over the DJ's head towards the crowd, while you're stood/sat controlling the beams from the back of the room. Doing it this way you don't need any sort of hard wired audio link.

I think i've pretty much got the audio side of LivePRO cracked now, that is until I find something else it can do

Cheers

Jem

[Mr.Coffee]

Hey Adam

You don't even have to jack into the main mixing board... Just plug a microphone into the 'line in' on your PC and pick up whatever noise is going on in the room at the time. This is great for when you have your laser on stage projecting out over the DJ's head towards the crowd, while you're stood/sat controlling the beams from the back of the room. Doing it this way you don't need any sort of hard wired audio link.

I think i've pretty much got the audio side of LivePRO cracked now, that is until I find something else it can do

Cheers

Jem

just to give you a heads-up, this post strays off-topic a bit.

While you don't "have to" connect to the actual source of the music, I think you'll find much better results if you do use a line out as your signal source.
that being said, there are a number of concerns when connecting two separate systems. when you bridge two systems, (and a simple audio connection counts), you have a couple questions that need to be answered before you make that connection. the first and foremost is power.

where is your power coming from? where is theirs? for larger audio systems, and especially where one-night events are concerned, it is not unusual for the audio system to be powered by a generator. a generator that may or may not be bonded to the ground. so you can get some interesting noise and/or ground loops, and that's the safer end of the spectrum.

basically, you need to isolate your system from the signal. you can to this many different ways,but your best bet is to use an audio isolation transformer. these are cheap and readily available, you just need to know what you're looking for. the most common variety (for sound guys based in the states, anyway) is the SESCOM IL-19 . if you search around or call around, you can probably find one. however, a cheaper and easier alternative can be found by looking for a "Ground loop isolator". sometimes you can get these at a radio shack, or in the car audio section of wal-mart.
for you non-us based people, try a car audio store, you know, where the kids go to get huge speakers put in their cars. they will probably have such a beast, or know where to get one. in that same scope, if you call a professional sound company, be it a sales or rental house, they will know where you can get audio isolation transformers. do specify that you want an audio transformer like the IL-19, otherwise you can end up with a 240lb coil of copper, since it is not uncommon for a sound rig to be isolated from the wall curent via such a beast.

sorry, I've gotten a bit off track. like vector graphics, i'm prone to tangents...

my main point is this: you want to isolate your signal to prevent noise: namely you sticking noise back into a system. any iso transformer you stick inline won't hurt your signal path or gain structure to the extent that your beat detection algorithms will notice.

I just figured I'd try to shed a little light on this already tangential subject, thanks for listening to my drunken pseudo-rant.

Edit: clarification of iso transformers

[Jem]

thanks for listening to my drunken pseudo-rant.

Hey, not at all. That's great information and much appreciated

I realise a direct link is always better, I was just giving an alternative. Trouble is with microphone's, they pick up anything, a noisy crowd for-instance. However, they are a quick and dirty way to get beat detection if a proper audio link is not possible.

P.S. Do you know much about Hazers, particularly the Unique 2 ? I could do with a few pointers to look out for such as...

Which is better hang time, cracked oil or glycol?
Do the modern cracked oil hazers leave as much residue as they used to?
Which units are particularly reliable?

I know the DF50 and the MDG Atmosphere are generally regarded as the best, but they're damned expensive and I can't really justify spending that amount of cash. I've heard the Unique 2 is quite good.

Cheers

Jem

[Insanity]

Thanks Mr Coffee...

That is very useful advice.. I do a lot of festivals which are all run off generators and would love to include the sound input.

The mic is a great idea, no extra cables to lug around and load out at the end of the night. The mic becomes problematic specifically at Drum and Bass events where there is a guy on the mic all night. Then you find lasers in time with his voice..

Without wanting to offend any MC's out there, I would prefer to unplug the mc and just have the music. But who am I to judge

Jem, you will have to take me through some of the sound stuff at the meet, think I have a fair bit of it nailed in Live Pro, but sounds like you know a lot more about it than me...

[Mr.Coffee]

Hey, not at all. That's great information and much appreciated

I realise a direct link is always better, I was just giving an alternative. Trouble is with microphone's, they pick up anything, a noisy crowd for-instance. However, they are a quick and dirty way to get beat detection if a proper audio link is not possible.

P.S. Do you know much about Hazers, particularly the Unique 2 ? I could do with a few pointers to look out for such as...

Which is better hang time, cracked oil or glycol?
Do the modern cracked oil hazers leave as much residue as they used to?
Which units are particularly reliable?

I know the DF50 and the MDG Atmosphere are generally regarded as the best, but they're damned expensive and I can't really justify spending that amount of cash. I've heard the Unique 2 is quite good.

Cheers

Jem

Jem,

well, I thought I knew a bit about hazers, but fortunately, this forum has already proved me wrong! i mean, cmon, I thought the df-50 was a water-based hazer!

that being said, every tour i've loaded in and out (as well as the one i'm currently on) has used/uses a df-50 or two for their atmospheric haze effects. (now, i'm talking about a theatrical setting, primarily musicals, where haze is used for "atmosphere", a setting, and fog is used for specific effects, being it a punch of smoke, or low-lying co2 type fog for effects.

so, in my opinion, a df-50 is good for haze, from what i've seen. now, the lematrie g-300 or 3000 (im not sure which), has fog and haze capabilites, but I cannot truly attest to the effect produced by this device.

that being said, you can always get a hotplate, a fan and some haze powder. it requires constant attention (ie, someone to sprinkle haze powder on the hotplate every couple of minutes), but the effect is great. it's a bit hazardous to the health, though, so you may not want to do it in confined spaces.

[Jem]

that being said, you can always get a hotplate, a fan and some haze powder. it requires constant attention (ie, someone to sprinkle haze powder on the hotplate every couple of minutes), but the effect is great. it's a bit hazardous to the health, though, so you may not want to do it in confined spaces.

I don't fancy that idea at all, it sounds pretty dodgy to me

Lasers in general present a bit of a problem. I like nice swirly smoke as this adds to the visual effect of the beams quite nicely. However, since the smoking ban in the UK people have come to expect nice clean air at indoor venues. That's why I think a Hazer is a good compromise as it's barely noticable until the lasers switch on. O.K., so you don't get the swirls associated with smoke, but you also don't get people moaning about how smoky it is and how we are supposed to be smoke free now.

Personally I never use the word 'smoke' as the UK is fast becoming smokophobic, which is fine when it comes to cigarette smoke ( i'm a non-smoker) but frustrating when you need something to show off all those nice beams


Insanity:
I wouldn't bank on me knowing a lot more than you... I'm hoping you can answer some questions on my Novation

Cheers

Jem

[Mr.Coffee]

if you want to assuage the worries of potential club-goers, you can always substitute the word "smoke" with "fog", "Haze", or "atmosphere". the fluids to produce such effects are also usually hypoallergenic, so if you ask when you buy, you have another talking point to disarm the masses.

[Insanity]

Jem,

Will be happy to look at the Remote Zero with you... Looks like I have been elected to do a Live Pro tutorial session, so won't include it in that as I want to stay generic... We have a few things to discuss so just fire away when we catch up...

re the smoke haze thing and non smoking.. I have laminated door signs that I put up for safety with the hazzard symbol and the text reading, "Warning Lasers will be used in this arena" I guess I will have to do some more to support this UK Nanny culture that is currently going on.. "Warning smoke machines will be used in this arena"..." Warning music will be played in this arena".."Warning alcohol will be consumed in this arena".. "Warning there will be other people in this arena" The list is endless LOL

[Jem]

Jem,

Will be happy to look at the Remote Zero with you... Looks like I have been elected to do a Live Pro tutorial session, so won't include it in that as I want to stay generic... We have a few things to discuss so just fire away when we catch up...

Yes, it's going to be a full day - no fun at all

re the smoke haze thing and non smoking.. I have laminated door signs that I put up for safety with the hazzard symbol and the text reading, "Warning Lasers will be used in this arena" I guess I will have to do some more to support this UK Nanny culture that is currently going on.. "Warning smoke machines will be used in this arena"..." Warning music will be played in this arena".."Warning alcohol will be consumed in this arena".. "Warning there will be other people in this arena" The list is endless LOL

I know exactly what you mean, i've just ordered some 'Lasers in Use' signs. How about one that says 'Anyone found farting in this area will be thrown out'.

Cheers

Jem

[Insanity]

hey hey,,, I think you are right, it has got so nannyfied (is that a word? it is now) in this country.. We will have to warn people of almost everything we do...