Commercial NON Varienced laser shows

[ElektroFreak]

I would be greatly in favor of a ham-radio-esque system. I have an amateur radio license, and I can say that getting one isn't the end of the world. Unlike the current laser laws, the rules and instructions surrounding becoming a licensed radio amateur are easily found and many texts are available (online and hard copy) to help out.

[mixedgas]

All i have to say is NY state

i would love to pay only $100 for class
as it is in ny you need to take a $1000 class offered like once a year by norman balled or have a degree in lasers

and thats the easy part then you need to take a test on biology, math and physics then pay $500 a year per laser that you own

when did they add the requirement for the class?

BTW, arizona is 330$ per year, for the whole business.

Steve

[VJ AIWAZ]

that requirement has always been there but you can get a waiver if you can prove 5 years(i think its 5 years not sure though) internship or work history

and yea we have to pay per laser they even tried to chrage a friend of mine for all his sale stock he fought it and evenualy won ny want all your money
technically you even have to pay for3a stuff as well so he said what about all the music stores and all those shops in china town the answer was kinda vage but somthing along the lines of theres nothing they can do about all those rouges

[heroic]

Being an "underground" show doesn't eliminate the variance requirement. If you are showing the laser to ANYONE who isn't an employee, it's a public performance.

That's not actually true. The "white area" commonly referenced was giving a show in the church basement after a service; the CDRH representative in question stated explicitly that this does not fall within their remit. The "black area" was giving a show where admission is charged and the laser show is an essential part of the activity being charged for, and the "grey area" is a free show in a paid venue. I imagine that the CDRH would only care about the grey area cases if they got complaints or someone was taking liberties.

There is considerable vagueness in the CDRH's remit as part of the Commerce wing of the government, and this doesn't help the laser show community at all. On top of that, applying medical device design review rules to entertainment devices is hurting innovation and erecting a barrier in trade between the USA and other countries. It's silly.

I'm not saying a huge free-for-all is the solution, and clearly some kind of licensing scheme is in order, but the current system is both broken and detrimental to safety since it is clearly unenforceable.

[flecom]

the current system is both broken and detrimental to safety since it is clearly unenforceable.

additionally, and possibly more detrimental, its fairly undocumented... show me one good book/website, some clear/concise writeup on laser show safety/requirements/laws in the US... hell we are discovering things randomly from "updates" about things like variances, and even then we don't exactly know what the $#%^ these guys are talking about half the time...

Problem is nobody cares, club owners/operators generally don't care either out of ignorance or a "meh they wont come after me" attitude, and frighteningly enough, they are generally right... so there can be all sorts of scary installs that nobody in their right mind would do, and really, whos going to do anything about it? the CDRH police? please...

meanwhile, people that want to do things right need to jump through insane hoops and paperwork for variances etc... and then we wonder why people do shows/projectors/etc without going through the proper channels? because why should they? if there are no consequences, and just frustration and confusion, why would anyone in their right mind really get a variance? insurance? liability? perhaps, but obviously a lot of people out there are either playing dumb, or just risking it

[instinct]

How do you guys feel about the current US law of over 5mw needing a variance? I was at a rave event about a months ago, and I was talking to the guy who set up the two lasers who was throwing the event. They were cheap china import lasers and said they are 50mw each. He did not have a variance for either, and didn't even know he needed one or what a variance is. I didn't feel too worried considering the lasers were only 50mw and it only hit the crowd in the very back of the venue.. Should I have been?


Note: I should add that the person who set up the lasers did not do lighting as job, but his "crew" bought them so they did not need to rent out lighting for their events.

[mixedgas]

[QUOTE=instinct;121586]How do you guys feel about the current US law of over 5mw needing a variance? I was at a rave event about a months ago, and I was talking to the guy who set up the two lasers who was throwing the event. They were cheap china import lasers and said they are 50mw each. He did not have a variance for either, and didn't even know he needed one or what a variance is. I didn't feel too worried considering the lasers were only 50mw and it only hit the crowd in the very back of the venue.. Should I have been?

50 mW point blank, static beam, will do damage faster then you can blink in many cases.
That is enough to say I don't think it is right at all.

50 mW cumulative from a slow beam is a issue.

Considering the difference between 50mW and 500mW is just the dollar figure, that is just scary.

Steve

[instinct]

[QUOTE=mixedgas;121784]

How do you guys feel about the current US law of over 5mw needing a variance? I was at a rave event about a months ago, and I was talking to the guy who set up the two lasers who was throwing the event. They were cheap china import lasers and said they are 50mw each. He did not have a variance for either, and didn't even know he needed one or what a variance is. I didn't feel too worried considering the lasers were only 50mw and it only hit the crowd in the very back of the venue.. Should I have been?

50 mW point blank, static beam, will do damage faster then you can blink in many cases.
That is enough to say I don't think it is right at all.

50 mW cumulative from a slow beam is a issue.

Considering the difference between 50mW and 500mW is just the dollar figure, that is just scary.

Steve

Doesn't Chauvet make a 10mw beam that is supposed to be legal because it is fatter?

[jamesx1234]

Yes they make a 10mw lasers. I have 8 of them.

[andyf97]

I am a firm believer that new users of lasers should be forced to attend laser safety training course before being able to purchase or use any laser equipment no matter what power it is. And I don’t mean a course that can be attended for money or paying a bribe and you get a certificate for simply attending. I mean one where an exam must be passed to qualify that person understands enough to carry out his functions in a safe way and the people doing this course should be people who don’t have laser product sales as a motivator for the course.

Of course the alarm bells will ring and people would say what about him and that guy and that company, they are 10 years in the industry, should they take the course too. Yes of course and they would easily pass it because they already have the knowledge.

These subjects have been covered in depth in several ILDA sessions and the outcome is usually nothing. We tried several times to promote such ideas but it is not so easy to create such rules that meet worldwide standards as different countries have different laws.

in the end I guess we will all be marked as dangerious, shows will be limited to a few mW thanks to a few idiots who have money to buy lasers but no brains to go with them. Anyway, If they had serious brains they would invest the money in something more beneficial as the prices for shows have become compairable to renting lighting fixtures.